Hi Jim,
Standard Names get built into URLs. I would therefore recommend that they do not include slashes!
Cheers, Roy.
Please note that I now work part-time from Tuesday to Thursday. E-mail response on other days is possible but not guaranteed!
From: Jim Biard [mailto:jbiard at cicsnc.org]
Sent: 27 May 2014 15:23
To: cf-metadata at cgd.ucar.edu
Subject: Re: [CF-metadata] Request for new standard-names: graupel, wind_gust, inland_water_area_fraction
Heiko,
I can see that. How about x/y_of_wind_gust? Wind of gust is a peculiar construction for English. I'd be in favor of either x/y_of_wind_gust or x/y_wind_gust.
Jim
On 5/26/14, 11:06 AM, Heiko Klein wrote:
Hi Jim,
while gust and wind gust are synonyms, wind gusts are immediately understood (and have 680.000 hits on google), while gust alone would leave me puzzled a while until I understand the context (and google will find a lot of people with the name Gust, but no wind).
With the definition of wind from x_wind: "Wind is defined as a
two-dimensional (horizontal) air velocity vector", I don't see so much redundancy in wind_of_gust. I'm quite ambivalent though about "x/y_wind_of_gust" or "x/y_wind_gust".
Heiko
On 2014-05-23 14:43, Jim Biard wrote:
Hi.
Wind_of_gust is weirdly redundant. How about x_gust and y_gust?
Jim
On 5/23/14, 5:15 AM, Heiko Klein wrote:
Dear John, Jonathan and Karl,
thank you for your feedback.
x_wind_[speed_]of_gust
I like best x_wind_of_gust, since x_wind is a vector-component of a
velocity, so it is not a pure speed, and neither a pure direction. I
think it should be as close to x_wind as possible - though I see the
point of eventually changing x_wind in the future.
In AROME, wind-gusts are parametrized in a different way than a pure
statistical extraction, so cell_method: time: max would be wrong here.
graupel_fall_amount
That is fine with us.
inland_water_area_fraction
I like the definition of wikipedia for sea:
"The sea is the connected body of salty water that covers over 70
percent of the Earth's surface."
The border between 'river-delta' and the sea might be very difficult
to define, though. It might be an idea to add this definition to
sea_area_fraction.
We use the area_fraction + type for soil-types. Since we use already
sea_area_fraction and land_area_fraction, inland_water_area_fraction
feels like a logical continuation of the division in land and water.
Best regards,
Heiko
On 2014-05-22 20:03, John Graybeal wrote:
Karl,
I've wondered about this 'gust' question myself, with respect to
wind_speed_of_gust, and to many other names with statistical components
(mean, st_dev, minimum, etc.). I've always assumed that this either
reflected (a) convenience, or (b) the reality that many sensors return
data that is already parameterized (?), and so the characteristics
required for cell methods might not be readily captured.
I would appreciate hearing further clarification of the CF principles in
these cases. (Can be added to the FAQ!)
John
On May 22, 2014, at 09:48, Karl Taylor <taylor13 at llnl.gov<mailto:taylor13 at llnl.gov>
<mailto:taylor13 at llnl.gov><mailto:taylor13 at llnl.gov>> wrote:
Hi Heiko et al.,
I agree that if we include the "gust" name, it should include "speed"
as in x_wind_speed_of_gust (for consistency with previous name).
Alternatively, I'm not sure wind_speed_of _gust should ever be used
when referring to observations or in many models, since it's just the
maximum wind speed occurring during an interval, and it's not a
different quantity from wind speed itself. If the
x_wind_speed_of_gust is some parameterized quantity and can't be
obtained from the x_wind time series (sampled at model time-step),
then there might be an argument for defining a new standard_name.
best regards,
Karl
On 5/22/14, 9:27 AM, John Graybeal wrote:
Hello Heiko, thanks for the requests.
Re x|y_wind_gust, for consistency with existing names would
x_wind_speed_of_gust and y_wind_speed_of_gust be OK, for
consistency with the existing name wind_speed_of_gust?
The description of graupel should be included in this definition.
For example "Graupel is precipitation that forms when supercooled
droplets of water are collected and freeze on a falling snowflake,
forming a 2-5 mm (0.079-0.197 in) ball of rime." Stolen from
wikipedia, you may have better/preferred language.
Re the name graupelfall_amount, my web search found only uses that
treat graupel as a separate word (except in German), so is
graupel_fall_amount acceptable? I know it doesn't match the
existing snowfall/rainfall etc., but those are common English words.
For inland_water_area_fraction, I don't know how to interpret
'inland water ... is all water-surfaces which are not "sea" '. Are
bays, fjords, etc. inland water? Is there a clear transition at the
river delta of which part is inland and which is not? For CF this
may not be essential, but if the answers are well known it would be
helpful to state them. (And if not, maybe just say something like
'inland water does not include any ocean or sea'.)
John
On May 22, 2014, at 01:10, Heiko Klein<Heiko.Klein at met.no><mailto:Heiko.Klein at met.no> wrote:
Hi,
we're currently converting the AROME model output to netcdf and
have problems finding good standard_names for some of the
parameters. Therefore, we would like to request the following new
standard_names:
x_wind_gust:
definition: "x" indicates a vector component along the grid
x-axis, positive with increasing x. Wind is defined as a
two-dimensional (horizontal) air velocity vector, with no vertical
component. (Vertical motion in the atmosphere has the standard
name upward_air_velocity.)
A gust is a sudden brief period of high wind speed. In an observed
timeseries of wind speed, the gust wind speed can be indicated by
a cell_methods of maximum for the time-interval. In an atmospheric
model which has a parametrised calculation of gustiness, the gust
wind speed may be separately diagnosed from the wind speed.
units: m/s
y_wind_gust:
(see x_wind_gust. The definition is taken from the existing x_wind
and wind_speed_of_gust)
graupelfall_amount:
definition: "Amount" means mass per unit area.
units: kg m-2
inland_water_area_fraction:
definition: "X_area_fraction" means the fraction of horizontal
area occupied by X. "X_area" means the horizontal area occupied by
X within the grid cell. "inland_water" is water surrounded by
land-masses like rivers and lakes, and is all water-surfaces which
are not "sea".
Best regards,
Heiko
(on behalf of the MET Norway Arome team)
--
Dr. Heiko Klein Tel. + 47 22 96 32 58
Development Section / IT Department Fax. + 47 22 69 63 55
Norwegian Meteorological Institutehttp://www.met.no
P.O. Box 43 Blindern 0313 Oslo NORWAY
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