Hi Jim,
while gust and wind gust are synonyms, wind gusts are immediately
understood (and have 680.000 hits on google), while gust alone would
leave me puzzled a while until I understand the context (and google will
find a lot of people with the name Gust, but no wind).
With the definition of wind from x_wind: "Wind is defined as a
two-dimensional (horizontal) air velocity vector", I don't see so much
redundancy in wind_of_gust. I'm quite ambivalent though about
"x/y_wind_of_gust" or "x/y_wind_gust".
Heiko
On 2014-05-23 14:43, Jim Biard wrote:
> Hi.
>
> Wind_of_gust is weirdly redundant. How about x_gust and y_gust?
>
> Jim
>
> On 5/23/14, 5:15 AM, Heiko Klein wrote:
>> Dear John, Jonathan and Karl,
>>
>> thank you for your feedback.
>>
>>
>> x_wind_[speed_]of_gust
>> I like best x_wind_of_gust, since x_wind is a vector-component of a
>> velocity, so it is not a pure speed, and neither a pure direction. I
>> think it should be as close to x_wind as possible - though I see the
>> point of eventually changing x_wind in the future.
>>
>> In AROME, wind-gusts are parametrized in a different way than a pure
>> statistical extraction, so cell_method: time: max would be wrong here.
>>
>>
>> graupel_fall_amount
>> That is fine with us.
>>
>>
>> inland_water_area_fraction
>> I like the definition of wikipedia for sea:
>> "The sea is the connected body of salty water that covers over 70
>> percent of the Earth's surface."
>> The border between 'river-delta' and the sea might be very difficult
>> to define, though. It might be an idea to add this definition to
>> sea_area_fraction.
>>
>> We use the area_fraction + type for soil-types. Since we use already
>> sea_area_fraction and land_area_fraction, inland_water_area_fraction
>> feels like a logical continuation of the division in land and water.
>>
>>
>> Best regards,
>>
>> Heiko
>>
>> On 2014-05-22 20:03, John Graybeal wrote:
>>> Karl,
>>>
>>> I've wondered about this 'gust' question myself, with respect to
>>> wind_speed_of_gust, and to many other names with statistical components
>>> (mean, st_dev, minimum, etc.). I've always assumed that this either
>>> reflected (a) convenience, or (b) the reality that many sensors return
>>> data that is already parameterized (?), and so the characteristics
>>> required for cell methods might not be readily captured.
>>>
>>> I would appreciate hearing further clarification of the CF principles in
>>> these cases. (Can be added to the FAQ!)
>>>
>>> John
>>>
>>>
>>> On May 22, 2014, at 09:48, Karl Taylor <taylor13 at llnl.gov
>>> <mailto:taylor13 at llnl.gov>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Hi Heiko et al.,
>>>>
>>>> I agree that if we include the "gust" name, it should include "speed"
>>>> as in x_wind_speed_of_gust (for consistency with previous name).
>>>>
>>>> Alternatively, I'm not sure wind_speed_of _gust should ever be used
>>>> when referring to observations or in many models, since it's just the
>>>> maximum wind speed occurring during an interval, and it's not a
>>>> different quantity from wind speed itself. If the
>>>> x_wind_speed_of_gust is some parameterized quantity and can't be
>>>> obtained from the x_wind time series (sampled at model time-step),
>>>> then there might be an argument for defining a new standard_name.
>>>>
>>>> best regards,
>>>> Karl
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On 5/22/14, 9:27 AM, John Graybeal wrote:
>>>>> Hello Heiko, thanks for the requests.
>>>>>
>>>>> Re x|y_wind_gust, for consistency with existing names would
>>>>> x_wind_speed_of_gust and y_wind_speed_of_gust be OK, for
>>>>> consistency with the existing name wind_speed_of_gust?
>>>>>
>>>>> The description of graupel should be included in this definition.
>>>>> For example "Graupel is precipitation that forms when supercooled
>>>>> droplets of water are collected and freeze on a falling snowflake,
>>>>> forming a 2?5 mm (0.079?0.197 in) ball of rime." Stolen from
>>>>> wikipedia, you may have better/preferred language.
>>>>>
>>>>> Re the name graupelfall_amount, my web search found only uses that
>>>>> treat graupel as a separate word (except in German), so is
>>>>> graupel_fall_amount acceptable? I know it doesn't match the
>>>>> existing snowfall/rainfall etc., but those are common English words.
>>>>>
>>>>> For inland_water_area_fraction, I don't know how to interpret
>>>>> 'inland water ... is all water-surfaces which are not "sea" '. Are
>>>>> bays, fjords, etc. inland water? Is there a clear transition at the
>>>>> river delta of which part is inland and which is not? For CF this
>>>>> may not be essential, but if the answers are well known it would be
>>>>> helpful to state them. (And if not, maybe just say something like
>>>>> 'inland water does not include any ocean or sea'.)
>>>>>
>>>>> John
>>>>>
>>>>> On May 22, 2014, at 01:10, Heiko Klein<Heiko.Klein at met.no> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Hi,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> we're currently converting the AROME model output to netcdf and
>>>>>> have problems finding good standard_names for some of the
>>>>>> parameters. Therefore, we would like to request the following new
>>>>>> standard_names:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> x_wind_gust:
>>>>>> definition: "x" indicates a vector component along the grid
>>>>>> x-axis, positive with increasing x. Wind is defined as a
>>>>>> two-dimensional (horizontal) air velocity vector, with no vertical
>>>>>> component. (Vertical motion in the atmosphere has the standard
>>>>>> name upward_air_velocity.)
>>>>>> A gust is a sudden brief period of high wind speed. In an observed
>>>>>> timeseries of wind speed, the gust wind speed can be indicated by
>>>>>> a cell_methods of maximum for the time-interval. In an atmospheric
>>>>>> model which has a parametrised calculation of gustiness, the gust
>>>>>> wind speed may be separately diagnosed from the wind speed.
>>>>>> units: m/s
>>>>>>
>>>>>> y_wind_gust:
>>>>>> (see x_wind_gust. The definition is taken from the existing x_wind
>>>>>> and wind_speed_of_gust)
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> graupelfall_amount:
>>>>>> definition: "Amount" means mass per unit area.
>>>>>> units: kg m-2
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> inland_water_area_fraction:
>>>>>> definition: "X_area_fraction" means the fraction of horizontal
>>>>>> area occupied by X. "X_area" means the horizontal area occupied by
>>>>>> X within the grid cell. "inland_water" is water surrounded by
>>>>>> land-masses like rivers and lakes, and is all water-surfaces which
>>>>>> are not "sea".
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Best regards,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Heiko
>>>>>> (on behalf of the MET Norway Arome team)
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> Dr. Heiko Klein Tel. + 47 22 96 32 58
>>>>>> Development Section / IT Department Fax. + 47 22 69 63 55
>>>>>> Norwegian Meteorological Institutehttp://www.met.no
>>>>>> P.O. Box 43 Blindern 0313 Oslo NORWAY
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>> CF-metadata mailing list
>>>>>> CF-metadata at cgd.ucar.edu
>>>>>> http://mailman.cgd.ucar.edu/mailman/listinfo/cf-metadata
>>>>> ------------------------------------
>>>>> John Graybeal
>>>>> Marine Data Manager
>>>>>
>>>>> M +1 408 675-5445
>>>>> skype: graybealski
>>>>> Marinexplore
>>>>> 920 Stewart Drive
>>>>> Sunnyvale 94085
>>>>> California, USA
>>>>> www.marinexplore.com
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> CF-metadata mailing list
>>>>> CF-metadata at cgd.ucar.edu
>>>>> http://mailman.cgd.ucar.edu/mailman/listinfo/cf-metadata
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>
>>> ------------------------------------
>>> *John Graybeal*
>>> Marine Data Manager
>>>
>>> M +1 408 675-5445
>>> skype: graybealski
>>> Marinexplore
>>> 920 Stewart Drive
>>> Sunnyvale 94085
>>> California, USA
>>> www.marinexplore.com <http://marinexplore.com>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
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>>> CF-metadata at cgd.ucar.edu
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>>>
>>
>
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--
Dr. Heiko Klein Tel. + 47 22 96 32 58
Development Section / IT Department Fax. + 47 22 69 63 55
Norwegian Meteorological Institute http://www.met.no
P.O. Box 43 Blindern 0313 Oslo NORWAY
Received on Mon May 26 2014 - 09:06:26 BST
