Roy,
It sounds like sway ought to be left-positive. But if the world is OK
with things otherwise, then OK.
Jim
On 8/3/18 11:36 AM, Lowry, Roy K. wrote:
>
> Dear Jim,
>
>
> I really don't think we need to take this approach. I'm investigating
> existing datasets in various European projects?and have yet to find
> anything that breaks the?conventions heave positive up, roll
> right-side down?, yaw positive clockwise and pitch positive nose up.
> I've yet to look into sway and surge which seem far less common in
> oceanographic data.?From his last e-mail?Ken's data products
> also?follow these conventions.
>
>
> Don't forget, we are adding definitions to existing Standard Names not
> creating new Standard Names and so should be aiming to cause as little
> disruption to the CF community as possible. Remember if we specify an
> attribute it would need to be added to all existing data.
>
>
> Cheers, Roy.
>
>
> I have now retired but will continue to be active through an Emeritus
> Fellowship using this e-mail address.
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> *From:* CF-metadata <cf-metadata-bounces at cgd.ucar.edu> on behalf of
> Jim Biard <jbiard at cicsnc.org>
> *Sent:* 03 August 2018 15:41
> *To:* cf-metadata at cgd.ucar.edu
> *Subject:* Re: [CF-metadata] Platform Heave
>
> I freely admit that I picked direction on sway arbitrarily. In my
> experience, part of the variation that arises in the definitions of
> the different motions arises from different thoughts about their use,
> particularly whether someone is thinking the values are used to
> transform into the platform body frame vs transform from it. Or maybe
> they just aren't worrying about consistency. Like as not, choices have
> often been made in attempts to make the values have the signed-ness
> that felt right to people, and we can't keep to conventions like the
> right hand rule and make it all work consistently. We want a positive
> pitch to be nose up. We want a positive yaw to be nose right. We want
> positive heave to be up. My natural tendency is to think of "roll
> right" as positive and "sway right" as positive, but that isn't what
> other people think of.
>
> As I read what I wrote, I realize I didn't use a consistent approach
> to position and look direction when assigning clockwise and
> anticlockwise to roll, pitch, and yaw. I need to regularize that.
>
> Reading the Conventions about vertical coordinates, it says they must
> all have a "positive" attribute with a value of "up" or "down". I
> don't see a problem with having the definitions back off of declaring
> a specific directionality and add an attribute declaring
> directionality. We could call the attribute "direction" so as not to
> step on the "positive" attribute, and say that if the attribute is not
> present that the user should not assume which direction is correct.
>
> If we declare that X is positive forward, that Y is positive left,
> that Z is positive up, and that we use the right-hand rule for angle
> directions, the direction attribute values could be:
>
> * roll: "clockwise" for positive right side up and "anticlockwise"
> for positive right side down.
> * pitch: "clockwise" for positive nose up and "anticlockwise" for
> positive nose down.
> * yaw: "clockwise" for positive nose right and "anticlockwise" for
> positive nose left.
> * surge: "positive" for positive forward and "negative" for positive
> backward.
> * sway: "positive" for positive left and "negative" for positive right.
> * heave: "positive" for positive up and "negative" for positive down.
>
> Thoughts?
>
> BTW, I'll be out until August 13.
>
> Grace and peace,
>
> Jim
>
> On 8/2/18 12:58 PM, Kenneth Kehoe wrote:
>> Thanks Nan and Roy for the positive direction information. I did the
>> Google search as Roy suggested and I found more images with Jim's
>> definition of positive with starboard down, but there are enough with
>> starboard up to think it's not a standard. This does point out my
>> main concern with putting positive direction in the standard name.
>> Would we then need to create a new standard name with the only
>> difference being the positive direction? I'm OK with doing this but I
>> worry about the increase of names. I think this needs to be a
>> different discussion, but putting the positive direction in an
>> attribute makes the most logical sense to me. I did take a stab at
>> trying to define a standard at this and it was not great.
>>
>> So at this time I'm proposing that if we define roll, sway we need to
>> define them twice to get both positive directions defined and
>> available for use. I don't think CF should force a convention on the
>> data, the user should be free to represent the data as it is produced
>> by the instrument.
>>
>> FYI a very quick search of the data products we produce:
>>
>> * pitch with nose up positive: 6
>> * roll with right side down positive: 6
>> * yaw with clockwise positive: 1
>> * sway with toward left side positive: 1
>> * surge with toward bow positive: 1
>> * heave with up positive: 1
>>
>>
>> Ken
>>
>>
>>
>> On 2018-8-2 09:29, Nan Galbraith wrote:
>>> Thank you, Jim, well done.
>>>
>>> My only concern is that platform_orientation is describing the same
>>> angle
>>> as yaw, and maybe should be deprecated.? The web is full of
>>> references to
>>> 'platform orientation', and a very quick check tells me they
>>> (mainly) refer to
>>> all 3 axes.
>>>
>>> I tried to check the sign of roll for ADCPs, since this is a
>>> variable that's output
>>> by the Teledyne-RDIs that we use, but I don't have the time to do a
>>> thorough job
>>> at this point. If different communities define this differently,
>>> Maybe we'll need to
>>> consider using an attribute.
>>>
>>> Cheers - Nan
>>>
>>> On 8/2/18 5:01 AM, Lowry, Roy K. wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Dear All,
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> You're not going to believe this, but try Googling 'pitch roll yaw'
>>>> and look through the images at the?roll sign convention. This
>>>> reveals some inconsistency on whether?positive roll is clockwise
>>>> when looking forward (Jim's definition)?or looking backward (Ken's
>>>> definition).
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> My personal experience from going to sea was that positive roll was
>>>> port to?starboard?- i.e. clockwise when looking forward. I'm pretty
>>>> sure the roll data?streams we handle (Autosub and gliders)
>>>> also?conform to this convention, but will ask somebody to check.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Could I suggest that Ken also?check his definition sources and data
>>>> streams.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Cheers, Roy.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>
>>>> *From:* CF-metadata <cf-metadata-bounces at cgd.ucar.edu>
>>>> <mailto:cf-metadata-bounces at cgd.ucar.edu> on behalf of Kenneth
>>>> Kehoe <kkehoe at ou.edu> <mailto:kkehoe at ou.edu>
>>>> *Sent:* 01 August 2018 22:51
>>>> *To:* cf-metadata at cgd.ucar.edu <mailto:cf-metadata at cgd.ucar.edu>
>>>> *Subject:* Re: [CF-metadata] Platform Heave
>>>> Sounds good to me except the platform_roll positive direction seems
>>>> to be opposite of what we have been describing. I typically have
>>>> platform roll positive for right-hand side rising.
>>>>
>>>> Ken
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On 2018-8-1 13:55, Jim Biard wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Hi.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Here is my proposal for a self-consistent and generic set of
>>>>> definitions for roll, pitch, yaw, surge, sway, heave, course, and
>>>>> orientation. I've tried to avoid lots of reference frame or vector
>>>>> terms, basing everything on the vertical direction and the nominal
>>>>> forward motion direction, which are two things all the moving
>>>>> platforms we are concerned with have, and which I think are easy
>>>>> enough to extrapolate to a stationary platform. I haven't bothered
>>>>> to do the *_rate definitions, since they are simple extrapolations
>>>>> of these definitions.
>>>>>
>>>>> I have taken the liberty of removing the redundant word "angle"
>>>>> from the definitions of roll, pitch, and yaw. It is like using
>>>>> "latitude angle" for latitude or "course angle" for course. We can
>>>>> make the redundant formulations aliases of the proper ones.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> *
>>>>>
>>>>> platform_roll: Roll is a rotation about an axis (the X axis) that
>>>>> is perpendicular to the local vertical axis (the Z axis) and is
>>>>> coplanar with the nominal forward motion direction for the
>>>>> platform. The rotation is positive clockwise about that axis when
>>>>> seen from behind the platform looking towards it (e.g. right-hand
>>>>> side falling), and relative to the ?at rest? rotation of the
>>>>> platform with respect to the X axis. Platform is a structure or
>>>>> vehicle that serves as a base for mounting sensors. Platforms
>>>>> include, but are not limited to, satellites, aeroplanes, ships,
>>>>> buoys, ground stations, and masts.
>>>>>
>>>>> **
>>>>>
>>>>> *
>>>>> *
>>>>>
>>>>> platform_pitch: Pitch is a rotation about an axis (the Y axis)
>>>>> that is perpendicular to both the local vertical axis (the Z axis)
>>>>> and the nominal forward motion direction for the platform. The
>>>>> rotation is positive clockwise about that axis when seen from the
>>>>> left of the platform looking towards it (e.g. front end rising),
>>>>> and relative to the ?at rest? rotation of the platform with
>>>>> respect to the Y axis. Platform is a structure or vehicle that
>>>>> serves as a base for mounting sensors. Platforms include, but are
>>>>> not limited to, satellites, aeroplanes, ships, buoys, ground
>>>>> stations, and masts.
>>>>>
>>>>> **
>>>>>
>>>>> *
>>>>> *
>>>>>
>>>>> platform_yaw: Yaw is a rotation about the local vertical axis (the
>>>>> Z axis). The rotation is positive clockwise about that axis when
>>>>> seen from above the platform looking towards it (e.g. front end
>>>>> turning to the right), and relative to the ?at rest? rotation of
>>>>> the platform with respect to the Z axis. Platform is a structure
>>>>> or vehicle that serves as a base for mounting sensors. Platforms
>>>>> include, but are not limited to, satellites, aeroplanes, ships,
>>>>> buoys, ground stations, and masts.
>>>>>
>>>>> **
>>>>>
>>>>> *
>>>>> *
>>>>>
>>>>> platform_surge: Surge is a displacement along an axis (the X axis)
>>>>> that is perpendicular to the local vertical axis (the Z axis) and
>>>>> is coplanar with the nominal forward motion direction for the
>>>>> platform. The displacement is positive for motion of the platform
>>>>> in the nominal forward motion direction (e.g. forward motion), and
>>>>> relative to the ?at rest? position of the platform with respect to
>>>>> the X axis. The ?at rest? position of the platform may change over
>>>>> time. Platform is a structure or vehicle that serves as a base for
>>>>> mounting sensors. Platforms include, but are not limited to,
>>>>> satellites, aeroplanes, ships, buoys, ground stations, and masts.
>>>>>
>>>>> **
>>>>>
>>>>> *
>>>>> *
>>>>>
>>>>> platform_sway: Sway is a displacement along an axis (the Y axis)
>>>>> that is perpendicular to both the local vertical axis (the Z axis)
>>>>> and the nominal forward motion direction for the platform. The
>>>>> displacement is positive for motion of the platform to the right
>>>>> of the nominal forward motion direction when seen from behind the
>>>>> platform looking towards it (e.g. rightward motion), and relative
>>>>> to the ?at rest? position of the platform with respect to the Y
>>>>> axis. The ?at rest? position of the platform may change over time.
>>>>> Platform is a structure or vehicle that serves as a base for
>>>>> mounting sensors. Platforms include, but are not limited to,
>>>>> satellites, aeroplanes, ships, buoys, ground stations, and masts.
>>>>>
>>>>> **
>>>>>
>>>>> *
>>>>> *
>>>>>
>>>>> platform_heave: Heave is a displacement along the local vertical
>>>>> axis (the Z axis). The displacement is positive for upward motion
>>>>> of the platform, and relative to the ?at rest? position of the
>>>>> platform with respect to the Z axis. The ?at rest? position of the
>>>>> platform may change over time. Platform is a structure or vehicle
>>>>> that serves as a base for mounting sensors. Platforms include, but
>>>>> are not limited to, satellites, aeroplanes, ships, buoys, ground
>>>>> stations, and masts.
>>>>>
>>>>> **
>>>>>
>>>>> *
>>>>> *
>>>>>
>>>>> platform_course: Course is the clockwise angle with respect to
>>>>> North of the nominal forward motion direction of the platform.
>>>>> Platform is a structure or vehicle that serves as a base for
>>>>> mounting sensors. Platforms include, but are not limited to,
>>>>> satellites, aeroplanes, ships, buoys, ground stations, and masts.
>>>>>
>>>>> **
>>>>>
>>>>> *
>>>>> *
>>>>>
>>>>> platform_orientation: Orientation is the clockwise angle with
>>>>> respect to North of the longitudinal (front-to-back) axis of the
>>>>> platform, which may be different than the platform course (see
>>>>> platform_course).*Platforms include, but are not limited to,
>>>>> satellites, aeroplanes, ships, buoys, ground stations, and masts.*
>>>>>
>>>>> *
>>>>> Grace and peace,
>>>>>
>>>>> Jim
>>>>>
>>>>> On 7/31/18 3:29 AM, Lowry, Roy K. wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On second thoughts removing the underscores is more elegant
>>>>>> correction than adding 'platform'.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Cheers, Roy.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I have now retired but will continue to be active through an
>>>>>> Emeritus Fellowship using this e-mail address.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>
>>>>>> *From:* CF-metadata <cf-metadata-bounces at cgd.ucar.edu>
>>>>>> <mailto:cf-metadata-bounces at cgd.ucar.edu>
>>>>>> <mailto:cf-metadata-bounces at cgd.ucar.edu>
>>>>>> <mailto:cf-metadata-bounces at cgd.ucar.edu> on behalf of Lowry, Roy
>>>>>> K. <rkl at bodc.ac.uk> <mailto:rkl at bodc.ac.uk>
>>>>>> <mailto:rkl at bodc.ac.uk> <mailto:rkl at bodc.ac.uk>
>>>>>> *Sent:* 30 July 2018 18:49
>>>>>> *To:* Kenneth Kehoe
>>>>>> *Cc:* CF Metadata List
>>>>>> *Subject:* Re: [CF-metadata] Platform Heave
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Hi Ken,
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> You're absolutely right - should have been platform_yaw_angle.
>>>>>> Getting the detail spot on in these things isn't easy, which is
>>>>>> why we have discussion lists!
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> With the way I'm currently seeing things?I don't agree that pitch
>>>>>> and roll affect the definition of heave. They are only factors
>>>>>> that come into account with the coupling of heave into the next
>>>>>> level of the CRS hierarchy.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Cheers, Roy.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I have now retired but will continue to be active through an
>>>>>> Emeritus Fellowship using this e-mail address.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>
>>>>>> *From:* CF-metadata <cf-metadata-bounces at cgd.ucar.edu>
>>>>>> <mailto:cf-metadata-bounces at cgd.ucar.edu>
>>>>>> <mailto:cf-metadata-bounces at cgd.ucar.edu>
>>>>>> <mailto:cf-metadata-bounces at cgd.ucar.edu> on behalf of Kenneth
>>>>>> Kehoe <kkehoe at ou.edu> <mailto:kkehoe at ou.edu>
>>>>>> <mailto:kkehoe at ou.edu> <mailto:kkehoe at ou.edu>
>>>>>> *Sent:* 30 July 2018 18:39
>>>>>> *Cc:* CF Metadata List
>>>>>> *Subject:* Re: [CF-metadata] Platform Heave
>>>>>> I agree with John the (keel to top of mast) statement is
>>>>>> incorrect when the platform is tilted. I only inserted that to
>>>>>> help describe the Z-axis. But I don't think it's helping. I think
>>>>>> John is also right on point with this since I can't find a
>>>>>> definition of heave that discusses the orientation of the
>>>>>> platform and how it relates to the measurement of heave. That is
>>>>>> why I'm suggesting we not try to tackle that issue. From an
>>>>>> instrument perspective I don't think the organization writing the
>>>>>> measurement to file actually know all the details of how the
>>>>>> values are derived or the full reference frame. I tell people to
>>>>>> not use the standard_name definitions unless they are positive it
>>>>>> matches exactly, and without all the information I don't think
>>>>>> people will be able to use a too specific definition. A less
>>>>>> specific definition would allow the use now, and a more specific
>>>>>> definition can be added later if needed.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I did like Roy's definition of platform_yaw_angle and
>>>>>> platform_yaw_rate. My only suggestion is to remove the underscore
>>>>>> in "yaw_angle" in the definition of platform_yaw_rate, or use the
>>>>>> full term "platform_yaw_angle". Otherwise it appears like a
>>>>>> reference to a different term.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Ken
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On 2018-7-30 10:52, John Graybeal wrote:
>>>>>>> 1) Now that we have another platform_heave comment, could we
>>>>>>> please create a new thread for the discussion on
>>>>>>> pitch/roll/heading? ?Maybe starting without all the historical
>>>>>>> points, at least the heave-related ones? Both are difficult
>>>>>>> conversations to follow in sequence.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 2) I have a concern about the last two heave definitions.
>>>>>>> ? a) "Heave is the linear motion along the vertical Z-axis (e.g.
>>>>>>> keel to top of mast) with positive values representing upward
>>>>>>> motion.?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I like the thrust of this definition, it?s simple to understand.
>>>>>>> However I don?t think it?s measured in the direction of keel to
>>>>>>> top of mast of the current or recent vessel position, is it? I
>>>>>>> rather assume it is perpendicular to a nominally level service,
>>>>>>> possibly in the direction of the gravity vector. The dictionary
>>>>>>> definition "Heaving is the linear motion along the vertical
>>>>>>> Z-axis? with the positive values coda seems closer.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> ? b) "upwards vertical displacement of a platform over a
>>>>>>> measurement time interval?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I can?t tell how to parse ?over? here. ?An upwards vertical
>>>>>>> displacement is relative to another position, and in this case I
>>>>>>> think that ?original? position is being measured (at least
>>>>>>> conceptually) during another time interval. It just needs a few
>>>>>>> words, something like ?of a platform when compared to its
>>>>>>> average vertical position over a corresponding time interface?.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> But I guess the fundamental issue is I can?t tell (and don?t
>>>>>>> actually know) what heave is determined with respect to. If my
>>>>>>> last 11 positions relative to average seas are 0, 1, 2, 2, 1, 4,
>>>>>>> 1, 2, 2, 1, 0 (think hilly!), I have no idea if the heave at the
>>>>>>> peak (?4?) is 4 or something else ? it just depends on when and
>>>>>>> how long the baseline measurement is, doesn?t it? ?(Or to put it
>>>>>>> another way, is the heave at the 7th point a negative number,
>>>>>>> since the ship just went down 3 units?) ?If someone can answer
>>>>>>> that then our best definition might be more obvious.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> John
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> ---------------------------------------
>>>>>>> John Graybeal
>>>>>>> jbgraybeal at mindspring.com <mailto:jbgraybeal at mindspring.com>
>>>>>>> <mailto:jbgraybeal at mindspring.com>
>>>>>>> <mailto:jbgraybeal at mindspring.com>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Jul 29, 2018, at 04:29, Lowry, Roy K. <rkl at bodc.ac.uk
>>>>>>>> <mailto:rkl at bodc.ac.uk> <mailto:rkl at bodc.ac.uk>
>>>>>>>> <mailto:rkl at bodc.ac.uk>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Dear All,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Giving it some thought over the weekend I realise that where we
>>>>>>>> lost the plot in this discussion was when we encountered
>>>>>>>> 'direction of travel'. Jim succinctly described platform motion
>>>>>>>> with the phrase 'nested co-ordinate systems'. What I failed to
>>>>>>>> realise - and I'm guessing I'm not alone - is that the pitch,
>>>>>>>> roll, heave etc. family of terms for platform motion refer
>>>>>>>> SOLELY to the innermost co-ordinate reference in that nest and
>>>>>>>> that the 'zero' for these measurements is 'platform at rest'.
>>>>>>>> This innermost co-ordinate reference comprises three orthogonal
>>>>>>>> axes that intersect at the platform's centre of gravity. Two of
>>>>>>>> these are horizontal (Ken's longitudinal X-axis and transverse
>>>>>>>> Y-axis) and the third vertical (Ken's vertical Z-axis). Others
>>>>>>>> make?no attempt to treat these parameters in the same way as
>>>>>>>> zenith, and I now realise?CF shouldn't be any different.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Having come to terms with this, Ken's definition elements hve a
>>>>>>>> beautiful simplicity that?can be slotted into Alison's compound
>>>>>>>> definitions. My only problem is the inclusion of nautical terms
>>>>>>>> like 'bow' and 'stern', but these can easily be replaced by
>>>>>>>> generic equivalents such as 'front' and 'back'. I would also
>>>>>>>> make it clearer is that zero is platform at rest.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> For example the definition pair for yaw become:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> platform_yaw_angle
>>>>>>>> "yaw _angle"?is the amount of rotation from the rest
>>>>>>>> position?around the vertical Z-axis with positive values
>>>>>>>> resulting in clockwise motion?when viewed from above.?The
>>>>>>>> vertical?Z axis, also known as the "yaw axis", is an imaginary
>>>>>>>> line running vertically through the platform's?centre of
>>>>>>>> gravity. Standard names for "platform" describe the motion and
>>>>>>>> orientation of the vehicle from which observations are made.
>>>>>>>> Platforms include, but are not limited to, satellites,
>>>>>>>> aeroplanes, ships, instruments and buoys.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> platform_yaw_rate
>>>>>>>> "platform_yaw_rate" is the change per unit time of "yaw_angle".
>>>>>>>> "yaw _angle"?is?the amount of rotation from the rest
>>>>>>>> position?around the vertical Z-axis with positive values
>>>>>>>> resulting in clockwise motion?when viewed from above.?The
>>>>>>>> vertical Z axis, also known as the "yaw axis", is an imaginary
>>>>>>>> line running vertically through the platform's centre of
>>>>>>>> gravity. Standard names for "platform" describe the motion and
>>>>>>>> orientation of the vehicle from which observations are made.
>>>>>>>> Platforms include, but are not limited to, satellites,
>>>>>>>> aeroplanes, ships, instruments and buoys.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> How does that work for people?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Cheers, Roy.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I have now retired but will continue to be active through an
>>>>>>>> Emeritus Fellowship using this e-mail address.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> *From:*CF-metadata <cf-metadata-bounces at cgd.ucar.edu
>>>>>>>> <mailto:cf-metadata-bounces at cgd.ucar.edu>
>>>>>>>> <mailto:cf-metadata-bounces at cgd.ucar.edu>
>>>>>>>> <mailto:cf-metadata-bounces at cgd.ucar.edu>> on behalf of Kenneth
>>>>>>>> Kehoe <kkehoe at ou.edu <mailto:kkehoe at ou.edu>
>>>>>>>> <mailto:kkehoe at ou.edu> <mailto:kkehoe at ou.edu>>
>>>>>>>> *Sent:*27 July 2018 16:49
>>>>>>>> *To:*cf-metadata at cgd.ucar.edu <mailto:cf-metadata at cgd.ucar.edu>
>>>>>>>> <mailto:cf-metadata at cgd.ucar.edu>
>>>>>>>> *Subject:*Re: [CF-metadata] Platform Heave
>>>>>>>> All,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Sorry for joining this conversation late. This is an important
>>>>>>>> discussion for my group and finding a resolution would be very
>>>>>>>> helpful. For my purposes I only need a good definition, which
>>>>>>>> might coincide with the nautical definitions. For examplethis
>>>>>>>> reference
>>>>>>>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.wartsila.com_encyclopedia_term_ship-2Dmotions&d=DwMFaQ&c=qKdtBuuu6dQK9MsRUVJ2DPXW6oayO8fu4TfEHS8sGNk&r=Vm7o2ZGxPkkqRuPs8nVMVQ&m=J2x5E3dUpn954rPN8-v-TFQOZiyobvfd2MaoRgJ8_Zg&s=GnqNqW163_p5PcNhTjRgd0qwnu6cR6JuDeQvE2qaBGQ&e=>
>>>>>>>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.wartsila.com_encyclopedia_term_ship-2Dmotions&d=DwMFaQ&c=qKdtBuuu6dQK9MsRUVJ2DPXW6oayO8fu4TfEHS8sGNk&r=Vm7o2ZGxPkkqRuPs8nVMVQ&m=J2x5E3dUpn954rPN8-v-TFQOZiyobvfd2MaoRgJ8_Zg&s=GnqNqW163_p5PcNhTjRgd0qwnu6cR6JuDeQvE2qaBGQ&e=>would
>>>>>>>> suffice for most of my needs except for the missing definition
>>>>>>>> of positive direction. I've asked about defining a positive
>>>>>>>> direction in the past using the "positive" attribute and it was
>>>>>>>> decided to not expand that attribute. If we can define the
>>>>>>>> positive direction in all the platform standard names that
>>>>>>>> would be great, but it should be universally existent for all
>>>>>>>> current and future platform definitions.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I would prefer to not get into the details of how a value is
>>>>>>>> derived in the definition as that is more of the cell_methods
>>>>>>>> domain. Also I find that confusing as heave on an ocean going
>>>>>>>> ship is not always measured as the difference between two GPS
>>>>>>>> points but could be an integration of a speed or acceleration.
>>>>>>>> This would result in two different measurements that depend on
>>>>>>>> the method, but both are correct.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I next attempted to come up with some definitions but I ended
>>>>>>>> up going down a wormhole of different reference frames only to
>>>>>>>> realize in the end my definitions will never match with the
>>>>>>>> values from the vendor supplied data values because my
>>>>>>>> definitions were becoming too specific. I can't find a
>>>>>>>> definition of heave that takes into account tides, large waves
>>>>>>>> (water or atmospheric), or orientation of the platform. They
>>>>>>>> all seem to be relative to the platform position some x time
>>>>>>>> ago. So here is my attempt at the definitions:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> platform_heave =? Heave is the linear motion along the vertical
>>>>>>>> Z-axis (e.g. keel to top of mast) with positive values
>>>>>>>> representing upward motion.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> platform_sway = Sway is the motion along the transverse Y-axis
>>>>>>>> (e.g. port to starboard) with positive values towards the
>>>>>>>> right-hand side the platform (starboard) when oriented towards
>>>>>>>> leading edge of the platform.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> platform_surge = Surge is the motion along the longitudinal
>>>>>>>> X-axis (e.g. stern to bow) with positive values indicating
>>>>>>>> motion towards the leading edge of the platform (bow).
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> platform_roll_angle = Roll is a rotation around a longitudinal
>>>>>>>> X-axis with positive values resulting in counter clockwise
>>>>>>>> motion (e.g. right-hand side rising) when oriented towards
>>>>>>>> leading edge of the platform.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> platform_pitch_angle = Pitch is a rotation around the
>>>>>>>> transverse Y-axis with positive values resulting in counter
>>>>>>>> clockwise motion (e.g. leading edge of the platform rising).
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> platform_yaw_angle = Yaw is a rotation around the vertical
>>>>>>>> Z-axis with positive values resulting in clockwise motion of
>>>>>>>> the forward section (bow) when viewed from above.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> platform_roll_rate = Roll rate is rotation change per unit time
>>>>>>>> around a longitudinal X-axis with positive values resulting in
>>>>>>>> counter clockwise motion (e.g. right-hand side rising) when
>>>>>>>> oriented towards leading edge of the platform.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> platform_pitch_rate = Pitch rate is rotation change per unit
>>>>>>>> time around the transverse Y-axis with positive values
>>>>>>>> resulting in counter clockwise motion (e.g. leading edge of the
>>>>>>>> platform rising).
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> platform_yaw_rate = Yaw rate is rotation change per unit time
>>>>>>>> around the vertical Z-axis with positive values resulting in
>>>>>>>> clockwise motion of the forward section (bow) when viewed from
>>>>>>>> above.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I know these differ from the current definitions, but I'm not
>>>>>>>> completely understanding how the definitions are created. Is
>>>>>>>> platform_orientation always prepended? Is a rate always defined
>>>>>>>> with the same as the angle definition but with a final sentence
>>>>>>>> explaining it's actually a rate?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Ken
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On 2018-7-25 09:50, Jim Biard wrote:
>>>>>>>>> Alison,
>>>>>>>>> It's a lovely nested reference frames problem, isn't it? Roll,
>>>>>>>>> pitch, and yaw are usually defined relative to a center of
>>>>>>>>> motion (CM) reference frame defined using the (mean) direction
>>>>>>>>> of motion and the up direction. In my (satellite-based)
>>>>>>>>> experience, the Y axis unit vector is defined by the
>>>>>>>>> normalized cross-product of the up unit vector with the
>>>>>>>>> direction of motion unit vector (Z x X). The X axis unit
>>>>>>>>> vector is then defined by the cross-product of the Y unit
>>>>>>>>> vector and the up unit vector (Y x Z). This means of forming
>>>>>>>>> the CM reference frame decouples orientation from motion. The
>>>>>>>>> X axis is not necessarily identical to the direction of
>>>>>>>>> motion. The vehicle reference frame may have fixed offsets in
>>>>>>>>> x, y, z, roll, pitch, and yaw relative to the CM reference
>>>>>>>>> frame, but in my limited experience those offsets have been zero.
>>>>>>>>> Platforms that aren't moving are an even more entertaining
>>>>>>>>> case, for sure!
>>>>>>>>> In the end, I'd tend towards referring to a CM or geospatial
>>>>>>>>> reference frame with the Z direction defined as "up" if I'm
>>>>>>>>> going to try and get detailed about it, as opposed to 'mean
>>>>>>>>> orientation'. But I only have experience with satellites (and
>>>>>>>>> a bit with airplanes).
>>>>>>>>> Grace and peace,
>>>>>>>>> Jim
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On 7/25/18 9:37 AM, Alison Pamment - UKRI STFC wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> Hi Roy and Jim,
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Thanks for your quick comments on the definitions. I have
>>>>>>>>>> just been looking again at the suggested text for yaw_angle:
>>>>>>>>>> 'Platform yaw angle is the angle between the platform's
>>>>>>>>>> longitudinal/X axis and the direction of travel. Zero yaw
>>>>>>>>>> angle means the longitudinal axis is aligned with the
>>>>>>>>>> direction of travel, or a reference direction if the platform
>>>>>>>>>> is stationary. The usual sign convention is that yaw angle is
>>>>>>>>>> measured positive when the front or leading edge of the
>>>>>>>>>> platform is rotated clockwise from its orientation (which has
>>>>>>>>>> the standard name platform_orientation).'
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> The problem is how to describe the reference direction which
>>>>>>>>>> the angle is calculated relative to. I started out by talking
>>>>>>>>>> about 'direction of travel' and later referred to
>>>>>>>>>> 'platform_orientation'. The definition of
>>>>>>>>>> platform_orientation says 'The platform orientation is the
>>>>>>>>>> direction in which the "front" or longitudinal axis of the
>>>>>>>>>> platform is pointing (not necessarily the same as the
>>>>>>>>>> direction in which it is travelling, called
>>>>>>>>>> platform_course).' I've realised my new definition doesn't
>>>>>>>>>> really make sense if direction of travel and orientation
>>>>>>>>>> aren't the same (and clearly they can be different). Also, if
>>>>>>>>>> 'orientation' is the instantaneous direction of the
>>>>>>>>>> longitudinal axis, then presumably it includes yaw angle, so
>>>>>>>>>> it isn't the right reference for measuring yaw.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I've revised the text as follows:
>>>>>>>>>> 'Platform yaw angle is the angle between the platform's
>>>>>>>>>> longitudinal/X axis and the platform's mean orientation (i.e.
>>>>>>>>>> its orientation not including high frequency variations due
>>>>>>>>>> to swaying and rocking motions, for example, ship motions
>>>>>>>>>> caused by the passing of sea surface waves). Zero yaw angle
>>>>>>>>>> means the longitudinal axis is aligned with the mean
>>>>>>>>>> orientation. The usual sign convention is that yaw angle is
>>>>>>>>>> measured positive when the front or leading edge of the
>>>>>>>>>> platform is rotated clockwise from its mean orientation
>>>>>>>>>> (which has the standard name platform_orientation).
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Does it sound okay to refer to a 'mean orientation' in this
>>>>>>>>>> way? I'm having trouble thinking of a better wording!
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Best wishes,
>>>>>>>>>> Alison
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> ------
>>>>>>>>>> Alison Pamment Tel: +44 1235 778065
>>>>>>>>>> NCAS/Centre for Environmental Data Archival
>>>>>>>>>> Email:alison.pamment at stfc.ac.uk
>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:Email:alison.pamment at stfc.ac.uk>
>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:alison.pamment at stfc.ac.uk>
>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:alison.pamment at stfc.ac.uk>
>>>>>>>>>> STFC Rutherford Appleton Laboratory
>>>>>>>>>> R25, 2.22
>>>>>>>>>> Harwell Oxford, Didcot, OX11 0QX, U.K.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>>>> From: CF-metadata<cf-metadata-bounces at cgd.ucar.edu>
>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:cf-metadata-bounces at cgd.ucar.edu>
>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:cf-metadata-bounces at cgd.ucar.edu>
>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:cf-metadata-bounces at cgd.ucar.edu>? On Behalf Of
>>>>>>>>>> Alison Pamment - UKRI STFC
>>>>>>>>>> Sent: 25 July 2018 13:12
>>>>>>>>>> To: Hamilton, Steve<sj.hamilton at fugro.com>
>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:sj.hamilton at fugro.com> <mailto:sj.hamilton at fugro.com>
>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:sj.hamilton at fugro.com>;cf-metadata at cgd.ucar.edu
>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:cf-metadata at cgd.ucar.edu>
>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:cf-metadata at cgd.ucar.edu>
>>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [CF-metadata] Platform Heave
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Dear Steve, Nan, et al,
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Thank you for proposing new standard names for platform_heave
>>>>>>>>>> and improved definitions for existing names for platform
>>>>>>>>>> pitch, roll and yaw. Thank you also to all those who
>>>>>>>>>> submitted comments about these names.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Regarding Steve's proposals for new names, the discussion
>>>>>>>>>> seems to have reached consensus on the quantities themselves.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Until now, our usual explanatory sentence for 'platform' has
>>>>>>>>>> said 'Standard names for platform describe the motion and
>>>>>>>>>> orientation of the vehicle from which observations are made
>>>>>>>>>> e.g. aeroplane, ship or satellite.' Nan has suggested
>>>>>>>>>> extending the list of possible platforms, which seems fair
>>>>>>>>>> enough, so we would now have 'Standard names for platform
>>>>>>>>>> describe the motion and orientation of the vehicle from which
>>>>>>>>>> observations are made. Platforms include, but are not limited
>>>>>>>>>> to, satellites, aeroplanes, ships, instruments, and buoys.'
>>>>>>>>>> I've added this into the definitions of Steve's names,
>>>>>>>>>> leading to:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> platform_heave (m)
>>>>>>>>>> 'Standard names for "platform" describe the motion and
>>>>>>>>>> orientation of the vehicle from which observations are made.
>>>>>>>>>> Platforms include, but are not limited to, satellites,
>>>>>>>>>> aeroplanes, ships, instruments, and buoys. "Heave" means the
>>>>>>>>>> vertical displacement of a platform (positive upwards) over a
>>>>>>>>>> measurement time interval.'
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> platform_heave_rate (m s-1)
>>>>>>>>>> 'Standard names for "platform" describe the motion and
>>>>>>>>>> orientation of the vehicle from which observations are made.
>>>>>>>>>> Platforms include, but are not limited to, satellites,
>>>>>>>>>> aeroplanes, ships, instruments, and buoys "Heave" means the
>>>>>>>>>> vertical displacement of a platform (positive upwards) over a
>>>>>>>>>> measurement time interval. "Heave rate" means the rate of
>>>>>>>>>> change of vertical displacement of the platform over a
>>>>>>>>>> measurement time interval.'
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> These two names are accepted for publication in the standard
>>>>>>>>>> name table and will be added in the next update, planned for
>>>>>>>>>> 6th August.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> We have six existing platform pitch, roll and yaw names:
>>>>>>>>>> platform_pitch_angle (degree)
>>>>>>>>>> platform_pitch_rate (degree s-1)
>>>>>>>>>> platform_roll_angle (degree)
>>>>>>>>>> platform_roll_rate (degree s-1)
>>>>>>>>>> platform_yaw_angle (degree)
>>>>>>>>>> platform_yaw_rate (degree s-1)
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Nan has suggested the following definitions, based
>>>>>>>>>> onhttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ship_motions
>>>>>>>>>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__en.wikipedia.org_wiki_Ship-5Fmotions&d=DwMDaQ&c=qKdtBuuu6dQK9MsRUVJ2DPXW6oayO8fu4TfEHS8sGNk&r=Vm7o2ZGxPkkqRuPs8nVMVQ&m=fsDk1eg5rM-so0h_XCTK_Pl1w5MGnQK88vuvHcbhUUI&s=gxXkUfvVSqtWNEzxwyAeuKgEMzADzXWv2OOZtOBRAao&e=>
>>>>>>>>>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__en.wikipedia.org_wiki_Ship-5Fmotions&d=DwMDaQ&c=qKdtBuuu6dQK9MsRUVJ2DPXW6oayO8fu4TfEHS8sGNk&r=Vm7o2ZGxPkkqRuPs8nVMVQ&m=fsDk1eg5rM-so0h_XCTK_Pl1w5MGnQK88vuvHcbhUUI&s=gxXkUfvVSqtWNEzxwyAeuKgEMzADzXWv2OOZtOBRAao&e=>.
>>>>>>>>>> (A quick search of other online sources yields definitions
>>>>>>>>>> consistent with these).
>>>>>>>>>> Pitch
>>>>>>>>>> The up/down rotation of a platform about its transverse/Y
>>>>>>>>>> axis. The transverse/Y axis, lateral or pitch axis is an
>>>>>>>>>> imaginary line running horizontally across the platform and
>>>>>>>>>> through its center of gravity. A pitch? motion is an
>>>>>>>>>> up-or-down movement of the bow and stern of the platform.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Roll
>>>>>>>>>> The tilting rotation of a platform about its longitudinal/X
>>>>>>>>>> axis. The longitudinal/X axis, or roll axis, is an imaginary
>>>>>>>>>> line running horizontally through the length of the platform,
>>>>>>>>>> through its center of gravity, and parallel to the waterline.
>>>>>>>>>> A roll motion is a side-to-side or port-starboard tilting
>>>>>>>>>> motion of the superstructure around this axis.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Yaw
>>>>>>>>>> The turning rotation of a platform about its vertical/Z axis.
>>>>>>>>>> The vertical/Z axis, or yaw axis, is an imaginary line
>>>>>>>>>> running vertically through the platform and through its
>>>>>>>>>> center of gravity. A yaw motion is a side-to side movement of
>>>>>>>>>> the bow and stern of the ship.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> These are useful and concise definitions. I suggest that we
>>>>>>>>>> don't refer anywhere to 'ship', 'bow' or 'stern', since we
>>>>>>>>>> want the definitions to apply to all possible platforms. I'm
>>>>>>>>>> thinking also that 'port' and 'starboard' may apply to ships
>>>>>>>>>> and aeroplanes, but perhaps not to a satellite, so are
>>>>>>>>>> probably best avoided. Similarly, 'waterline' only applies to
>>>>>>>>>> maritime platforms. I suggest the following amendments to
>>>>>>>>>> make the definitions as generic as possible:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Pitch
>>>>>>>>>> "Pitch" means rotation of the platform in the vertical plane
>>>>>>>>>> about its transverse/Y axis. The transverse/Y axis, also
>>>>>>>>>> known as the "lateral axis" or "pitch axis", is an imaginary
>>>>>>>>>> line running horizontally across the platform and through its
>>>>>>>>>> center of gravity. In pitch motion, the leading edge of the
>>>>>>>>>> platform moves vertically upwards while the rear moves
>>>>>>>>>> vertically downwards, and vice versa.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Roll
>>>>>>>>>> "Roll" means rotation of the platform in the vertical plane
>>>>>>>>>> about its longitudinal/X axis. The longitudinal/X axis, also
>>>>>>>>>> known as the "roll axis", is an imaginary line running
>>>>>>>>>> horizontally through the length of the platform and through
>>>>>>>>>> its center of gravity. In roll motion, the platform tilts
>>>>>>>>>> such that one side moves vertically upwards while the other
>>>>>>>>>> moves vertically downwards, and vice versa.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Yaw
>>>>>>>>>> "Yaw" means rotation of the platform in the horizontal plane
>>>>>>>>>> about its vertical/Z axis. The vertical/Z axis, also known as
>>>>>>>>>> the "yaw axis", is an imaginary line running vertically
>>>>>>>>>> through the platform and through its center of gravity. In
>>>>>>>>>> yaw motion, the platform rotates clockwise or counter
>>>>>>>>>> clockwise in the horizontal, relative to its orientation,
>>>>>>>>>> which has the standard name platform_orientation.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Are these okay?
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> For names such as platform_view_angle and
>>>>>>>>>> platform_zenith_angle we also describe how the angle itself
>>>>>>>>>> is measured. We should do the same for pitch, roll and yaw
>>>>>>>>>> angles while we are in the process of updating the
>>>>>>>>>> definitions. I have come up with the following:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Pitch angle
>>>>>>>>>> Platform pitch angle is the angle between the local
>>>>>>>>>> horizontal and the platform's longitudinal/X axis. Zero pitch
>>>>>>>>>> angle means the longitudinal axis is horizontal. The usual
>>>>>>>>>> sign convention is that pitch angle is measured positive when
>>>>>>>>>> the front or leading edge of the platform is elevated above
>>>>>>>>>> the horizontal, negative when it is below the horizontal.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Roll angle
>>>>>>>>>> Platform roll angle is the angle between the local horizontal
>>>>>>>>>> and the platform's lateral/Y axis. Zero roll angle means the
>>>>>>>>>> lateral axis is horizontal. The usual sign convention is that
>>>>>>>>>> roll angle is measured positive when the right hand edge of
>>>>>>>>>> the platform (when viewing towards the orientation direction
>>>>>>>>>> or "front" of the platform) is elevated above the horizontal,
>>>>>>>>>> negative when it is below the horizontal.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Yaw angle
>>>>>>>>>> Platform yaw angle is the angle between the platform's
>>>>>>>>>> longitudinal/X axis and the direction of travel. Zero yaw
>>>>>>>>>> angle means the longitudinal axis is aligned with the
>>>>>>>>>> direction of travel, or a reference direction if the platform
>>>>>>>>>> is stationary. The usual sign convention is that yaw angle is
>>>>>>>>>> measured positive when the front or leading edge of the
>>>>>>>>>> platform is rotated clockwise from its orientation (which has
>>>>>>>>>> the standard name platform_orientation).
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Just so we can see a couple of examples of pulling all this
>>>>>>>>>> together, I've written out the full revised definitions of
>>>>>>>>>> platform platform_pitch_angle and platform_pitch_rate below.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> platform_pitch_angle (degree)
>>>>>>>>>> 'Standard names for "platform" describe the motion and
>>>>>>>>>> orientation of the vehicle from which observations are made.
>>>>>>>>>> Platforms include, but are not limited to, satellites,
>>>>>>>>>> aeroplanes, ships, instruments and buoys. "Pitch" means
>>>>>>>>>> rotation of the platform in the vertical plane about its
>>>>>>>>>> transverse/Y axis. The transverse/Y axis, also known as the
>>>>>>>>>> "lateral axis" or "pitch axis", is an imaginary line running
>>>>>>>>>> horizontally across the platform and through its center of
>>>>>>>>>> gravity. In pitch motion, the leading edge of the platform
>>>>>>>>>> moves vertically upwards while the rear moves vertically
>>>>>>>>>> downwards, and vice versa. Platform pitch angle is the angle
>>>>>>>>>> between the local horizontal and the platform's
>>>>>>>>>> longitudinal/X axis. Zero pitch angle means the longitudinal
>>>>>>>>>> axis is horizontal. The usual sign convention is that pitch
>>>>>>>>>> angle is measured positive when the front or leading edge of
>>>>>>>>>> the platform is elevated above the horizontal, negative when
>>>>>>>>>> it is below the horizontal.'
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> platform_pitch_rate (degree s-1)
>>>>>>>>>> 'Standard names for "platform" describe the motion and
>>>>>>>>>> orientation of the vehicle from which observations are made.
>>>>>>>>>> Platforms include, but are not limited to, satellites,
>>>>>>>>>> aeroplanes, ships, instruments and buoys. "Pitch" means
>>>>>>>>>> rotation of the platform in the vertical plane about its
>>>>>>>>>> transverse/Y axis. The transverse/Y axis, also known as the
>>>>>>>>>> "lateral axis" or "pitch axis", is an imaginary line running
>>>>>>>>>> horizontally across the platform and through its center of
>>>>>>>>>> gravity. In pitch motion, the leading edge of the platform
>>>>>>>>>> moves vertically upwards while the rear moves vertically
>>>>>>>>>> downwards, and vice versa. The quantity with standard name
>>>>>>>>>> platform_pitch_rate is the change per unit time in the
>>>>>>>>>> quantity with standard name platform_pitch_angle.'
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> The roll and yaw definitions would be constructed similarly.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> The pitch/roll/yaw names are still under discussion. I'd
>>>>>>>>>> welcome further comments on these.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Best wishes,
>>>>>>>>>> Alison
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> ------
>>>>>>>>>> Alison Pamment Tel: +44 1235 778065
>>>>>>>>>> NCAS/Centre for Environmental Data Archival
>>>>>>>>>> Email:alison.pamment at stfc.ac.uk
>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:Email:alison.pamment at stfc.ac.uk>
>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:alison.pamment at stfc.ac.uk>
>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:alison.pamment at stfc.ac.uk>
>>>>>>>>>> STFC Rutherford Appleton Laboratory
>>>>>>>>>> R25, 2.22
>>>>>>>>>> Harwell Oxford, Didcot, OX11 0QX, U.K.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>>>> From: CF-metadata<cf-metadata-bounces at cgd.ucar.edu>
>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:cf-metadata-bounces at cgd.ucar.edu>
>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:cf-metadata-bounces at cgd.ucar.edu>
>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:cf-metadata-bounces at cgd.ucar.edu>? On Behalf Of
>>>>>>>>>> Hamilton, Steve
>>>>>>>>>> Sent: 11 July 2018 10:52
>>>>>>>>>> To:cf-metadata at cgd.ucar.edu
>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:To:cf-metadata at cgd.ucar.edu>
>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:cf-metadata at cgd.ucar.edu>
>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:cf-metadata at cgd.ucar.edu>
>>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [CF-metadata] Platform Heave
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Hi Nan,
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I agree expanding on the existing standard name descriptions
>>>>>>>>>> does make sense and standardising for _rate and _angle
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> What you suggest below seems acceptable
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Thanks
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Steve
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>>>> From: CF-metadata<cf-metadata-bounces at cgd.ucar.edu>
>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:cf-metadata-bounces at cgd.ucar.edu>
>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:cf-metadata-bounces at cgd.ucar.edu>
>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:cf-metadata-bounces at cgd.ucar.edu>? On Behalf Of Nan
>>>>>>>>>> Galbraith
>>>>>>>>>> Sent: 10 July 2018 17:39
>>>>>>>>>> To:cf-metadata at cgd.ucar.edu
>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:To:cf-metadata at cgd.ucar.edu>
>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:cf-metadata at cgd.ucar.edu>
>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:cf-metadata at cgd.ucar.edu>
>>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [CF-metadata] Platform Heave
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Hi Alison, Steve, and all -
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Since we have a little time to finalize this, could we also
>>>>>>>>>> consider updating the definitions of platform_pitch_angle,
>>>>>>>>>> platform_roll_angle and platform_yaw_angle?
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Currently, these all say 'Standard names for platform
>>>>>>>>>> describe the motion and orientation of the vehicle from which
>>>>>>>>>> observations are made e.g. aeroplane, ship or satellite.'
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> John Helly pointed to the helpful Wikipedia page for ship
>>>>>>>>>> motion,https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ship_motions
>>>>>>>>>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__en.wikipedia.org_wiki_Ship-5Fmotions&d=DwMDaQ&c=qKdtBuuu6dQK9MsRUVJ2DPXW6oayO8fu4TfEHS8sGNk&r=Vm7o2ZGxPkkqRuPs8nVMVQ&m=fsDk1eg5rM-so0h_XCTK_Pl1w5MGnQK88vuvHcbhUUI&s=gxXkUfvVSqtWNEzxwyAeuKgEMzADzXWv2OOZtOBRAao&e=>
>>>>>>>>>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__en.wikipedia.org_wiki_Ship-5Fmotions&d=DwMDaQ&c=qKdtBuuu6dQK9MsRUVJ2DPXW6oayO8fu4TfEHS8sGNk&r=Vm7o2ZGxPkkqRuPs8nVMVQ&m=fsDk1eg5rM-so0h_XCTK_Pl1w5MGnQK88vuvHcbhUUI&s=gxXkUfvVSqtWNEzxwyAeuKgEMzADzXWv2OOZtOBRAao&e=>.
>>>>>>>>>> The suggestions below are merged from different sections of
>>>>>>>>>> that page, and might be a little ... long, but I'd also like
>>>>>>>>>> to append something like 'Platforms include but are not
>>>>>>>>>> limited to satellites, aeroplanes, ships, instruments, and
>>>>>>>>>> buoys.'
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Pitch
>>>>>>>>>> The up/down rotation of a platform about its transverse/Y
>>>>>>>>>> axis. The transverse/Y axis, lateral or pitch axis is an
>>>>>>>>>> imaginary line running horizontally across the platform and
>>>>>>>>>> through its center of gravity. A pitch? motion is an
>>>>>>>>>> up-or-down movement of the bow and stern of the platform.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Roll
>>>>>>>>>> The tilting rotation of a platform about its longitudinal/X
>>>>>>>>>> axis. The longitudinal/X axis, or roll axis, is an imaginary
>>>>>>>>>> line running horizontally through the length of the platform,
>>>>>>>>>> through its center of gravity, and parallel to the waterline.
>>>>>>>>>> A roll motion is a side-to-side or port-starboard tilting
>>>>>>>>>> motion of the superstructure around this axis.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Yaw
>>>>>>>>>> The turning rotation of a platform about its vertical/Z axis.
>>>>>>>>>> The vertical/Z axis, or yaw axis, is an imaginary line
>>>>>>>>>> running vertically through the platform and through its
>>>>>>>>>> center of gravity.
>>>>>>>>>> A yaw motion is a side-to side movement of the bow and stern
>>>>>>>>>> of the ship.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> And we had something like this for heave:
>>>>>>>>>> platform_heave (m) = upwards vertical displacement
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I suppose these could also be applied to platform_*_rates.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Regards -
>>>>>>>>>> Nan
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> On 7/4/18 4:47 AM, Alison Pamment - UKRI STFC wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Dear Steve,? > > Thank you for your message and apologies
>>>>>>>>>>> for not
>>>>>>>>>>> having processed
>>>>>>>>>> ? > your proposals as yet. I have been working on the CMIP
>>>>>>>>>> names, but > they are reaching a conclusion and I will
>>>>>>>>>> shortly be looking through > the many other proposals that
>>>>>>>>>> have been waiting for attention. > > A quick look through the
>>>>>>>>>> discussion of your names shows they are > pretty much agreed.
>>>>>>>>>> You need take no further action at this time - I > will check
>>>>>>>>>> that the names and definitions are clear and consistent >
>>>>>>>>>> with existing names and get back to you on the list with any
>>>>>>>>>> final > comments or questions. Version 56 of the standard
>>>>>>>>>> name table will be > published later today - I think we can
>>>>>>>>>> probably finalise your names > in time for version 57. > >
>>>>>>>>>> Best wishes, Alison
>>>>>>>>>>> ________________________________
>>>>>>>>>>> From: Hamilton, Steve<sj.hamilton at fugro.com>
>>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:sj.hamilton at fugro.com>
>>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:sj.hamilton at fugro.com> <mailto:sj.hamilton at fugro.com>
>>>>>>>>>>> Sent: 03 July 2018 09:12
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Please can you advise if this standard name has now been
>>>>>>>>>>> accepted and
>>>>>>>>>>> when it will be included in the CF Standard Names
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> If there is something else to do please let me know
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Thanks
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Steve
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> ________________________________
>>>>>>>>>>> From: Jim Biard <jbiard at cicsnc.org
>>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:jbiard at cicsnc.org> <mailto:jbiard at cicsnc.org>
>>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:jbiard at cicsnc.org><mailto:jbiard at cicsnc.org>
>>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:jbiard at cicsnc.org> <mailto:jbiard at cicsnc.org>
>>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:jbiard at cicsnc.org>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Sent: 01 June 2018 22:56
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Nan,
>>>>>>>>>>> Thanks for pulling things back in. I very much like the idea
>>>>>>>>>>> of keeping technology or specific methods out of the
>>>>>>>>>>> definition if at all possible, so I like your proposal. I
>>>>>>>>>>> expect we should include platform in the definition, as well
>>>>>>>>>>> as an indication that this is dynamic (over time). How about
>>>>>>>>>>> these definitions?
>>>>>>>>>>> platform_heave (m) = upwards vertical displacement of a
>>>>>>>>>>> platform over
>>>>>>>>>>> a measurement time interval platform_heave_rate (m s-1) =
>>>>>>>>>>> upwards rate
>>>>>>>>>>> of change in vertical displacement of a platform over a
>>>>>>>>>>> measurement time interval They leave out some detail but
>>>>>>>>>>> capture the relative nature of the quantities.
>>>>>>>>>>> (In my mind, the primary detail being left out is the 'net
>>>>>>>>>>> zero'
>>>>>>>>>>> nature of the quantities, which gets back to defining the
>>>>>>>>>>> 'moving-mean' sea level reference point.) Grace and peace,
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Jim
>>>>>>>>>>> On 6/1/18 11:23 AM, Nan Galbraith wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> Hi all -
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> The latest version is confusing to me. The term 'a platform
>>>>>>>>>>> that is
>>>>>>>>>>> nominally at rest' does not apply to many platforms for
>>>>>>>>>>> which heave is
>>>>>>>>>>> calculated; the original version of that, 'a moving object
>>>>>>>>>>> above the
>>>>>>>>>>> vertical level of that object when stationary' was maybe a
>>>>>>>>>>> little more clear... if also a little wordy.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> And, the term? 'vertical displacement determined by integrating
>>>>>>>>>>> vertical accelerations' may also not apply - I've been
>>>>>>>>>>> looking at the
>>>>>>>>>>> different ways heave is calculated, and there are a few:
>>>>>>>>>>> 'Heave can be
>>>>>>>>>>> computed from GPS RTK height measurements and from vertical
>>>>>>>>>>> accelerations measured by linear accelerometers'
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Why? not keep it simple: platform_heave (m) = upwards vertical
>>>>>>>>>>> displacement?? Do we need to be more specific than that?
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Thanks - Nan
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> From: Lowry, Roy K.
>>>>>>>>>>> Sent: 30 May 2018 21:37
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> An afterthought. Heave is conventionally positive upwards so
>>>>>>>>>>> to make this clear I would add the word 'upwards' thus:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> platform_heave (m) = upwards vertical displacement
>>>>>>>>>>> determined by integrating vertical accelerations of a
>>>>>>>>>>> platform that is nominally at rest.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> platform_heave_rate (m s-1) = upwards vertical velocity
>>>>>>>>>>> determined by integrating vertical accelerations of a
>>>>>>>>>>> platform that is nominally at rest.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Cheers. Roy.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> From: Lowry, Roy K. <rkl at bodc.ac.uk <mailto:rkl at bodc.ac.uk>
>>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:rkl at bodc.ac.uk>
>>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:rkl at bodc.ac.uk><mailto:rkl at bodc.ac.uk>
>>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:rkl at bodc.ac.uk> <mailto:rkl at bodc.ac.uk>
>>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:rkl at bodc.ac.uk>
>>>>>>>>>>> Sent: 30 May 2018 21:02
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Thanks Jim,
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> That work for me.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Cheers, Roy.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> From: Jim Biard<jbiard at cicsnc.org>
>>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:jbiard at cicsnc.org> <mailto:jbiard at cicsnc.org>
>>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:jbiard at cicsnc.org>
>>>>>>>>>>> Sent: 30 May 2018 18:39
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Roy,
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> So, heave is integrated vertical acceleration? How about
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> platform_heave (m) = vertical displacement determined by
>>>>>>>>>>> integrating vertical accelerations of a platform that is
>>>>>>>>>>> nominally at rest.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> platform_heave_rate (m s-1) = vertical velocity determined
>>>>>>>>>>> by integrating vertical accelerations of a platform that is
>>>>>>>>>>> nominally at rest.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Jim
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> On 5/27/18 5:38 AM, Lowry, Roy K. wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> ????? Hi Jim,
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> ????? Does
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> ?????????? "Heave" is a term used to describe the vertical
>>>>>>>>>>> displacement
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????? of a moving object above the vertical level of
>>>>>>>>>>> that object
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????? when stationary.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> ????? help by getting rid of the semantically-loaded word
>>>>>>>>>>> 'height'?
>>>>>>>>>>> ????? If not, what would?
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> ????? I think the confusion is because you are thinking of
>>>>>>>>>>> heave in
>>>>>>>>>>> ????? terms of position within a reference frame. To think
>>>>>>>>>>> of it as the
>>>>>>>>>>> ????? vertical displacement between a real platform and a
>>>>>>>>>>> massless
>>>>>>>>>>> ????? platform is misleading- such considerations are part
>>>>>>>>>>> of the
>>>>>>>>>>> ????? derivation of wave height from high frequency heave
>>>>>>>>>>> measurements,
>>>>>>>>>>> ????? which isn't relevant to a discussion of the raw
>>>>>>>>>>> measurement. It's
>>>>>>>>>>> ????? also worth bearing in mind that whilst the debate has
>>>>>>>>>>> focused on
>>>>>>>>>>> ????? platforms floating on the sea surface, the concept of
>>>>>>>>>>> heave could
>>>>>>>>>>> ????? in theory be applied to objects in the atmosphere.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> ????? In practice, heave is measured by accelerometers that
>>>>>>>>>>> are usually
>>>>>>>>>>> ????? combined with tilt sensors that give pitch, roll and
>>>>>>>>>>> yaw. Hence,
>>>>>>>>>>> ????? it is totally decoupled from any reference outside the
>>>>>>>>>>> platform.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> ????? To answer your last muse, to get heave from a high
>>>>>>>>>>> frequency
>>>>>>>>>>> ????? height relative to datum time series the method would
>>>>>>>>>>> need to
>>>>>>>>>>> ????? determine the height of the object when 'stationary'.
>>>>>>>>>>> In the case
>>>>>>>>>>> ????? of objects on the sea, 'stationary' is considered to
>>>>>>>>>>> be a flat
>>>>>>>>>>> ????? calm sea (i.e. no waves), which can be approximated by
>>>>>>>>>>> averaging
>>>>>>>>>>> ????? the raw time series. So, heave could be approximated by
>>>>>>>>>>> ????? differencing the raw and averaged data. However, I
>>>>>>>>>>> can't think why
>>>>>>>>>>> ????? anybody would want to do that.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> ????? Cheers, Roy.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> ????? From:Jim Biard<jbiard at cicsnc.org>
>>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:jbiard at cicsnc.org> <mailto:jbiard at cicsnc.org>
>>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:jbiard at cicsnc.org><mailto:jbiard at cicsnc.org>
>>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:jbiard at cicsnc.org> <mailto:jbiard at cicsnc.org>
>>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:jbiard at cicsnc.org>
>>>>>>>>>>> ????? Sent: 26 May 2018 23:18
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> ????? My biggest concern is that the standard name
>>>>>>>>>>> definition makes it
>>>>>>>>>>> ????? clear in some fashion or other that this is a measure of
>>>>>>>>>>> ????? deviations from some lower frequency (or low-pass
>>>>>>>>>>> filtered)
>>>>>>>>>>> ????? measure of vertical position. (As are sway and surge
>>>>>>>>>>> in relation
>>>>>>>>>>> ????? to their corresponding horizontal coordinates.) As was
>>>>>>>>>>> pointed
>>>>>>>>>>> ????? out, heave is used in certain communities, so it's
>>>>>>>>>>> reasonable to
>>>>>>>>>>> ????? provide a standard name, but it seems rather imprecise
>>>>>>>>>>> as it has
>>>>>>>>>>> ????? been described so far.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> ????? If I have understood the explanations correctly, a
>>>>>>>>>>> time series of
>>>>>>>>>>> ????? platform height relative to a fixed datum that has
>>>>>>>>>>> sufficient
>>>>>>>>>>> ????? precision and frequency would fully represent the
>>>>>>>>>>> heave along with
>>>>>>>>>>> ????? the more slowly varying effects of tide, waves, etc.
>>>>>>>>>>> So is heave,
>>>>>>>>>>> ????? as usually used, the first-order instantaneous
>>>>>>>>>>> difference between
>>>>>>>>>>> ????? the height of an actual platform and the height of a
>>>>>>>>>>> massless
>>>>>>>>>>> ????? ideal platform that would maintain a fixed offset
>>>>>>>>>>> relative to the
>>>>>>>>>>> ????? sea surface? And, just out of curiosity, how would a
>>>>>>>>>>> time series
>>>>>>>>>>> ????? of instantaneous measures of height relative to a
>>>>>>>>>>> fixed datum be
>>>>>>>>>>> ????? separated in practice into heave and "non-heave" height?
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> ????? Getting back on track, it seems to me that the
>>>>>>>>>>> definition ought to
>>>>>>>>>>> ????? somehow assist the reader in understanding how heave
>>>>>>>>>>> relates to
>>>>>>>>>>> ????? other measures of height.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> ????? On Sat, May 26, 2018 at 3:11 AM, Lowry, Roy K. wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????? Dear Jim and John,
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????? Heave is indeed a height relative to a datum, that
>>>>>>>>>>> datum being
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????? the calm sea surface, which is a local short
>>>>>>>>>>> interval mean sea
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????? level that isn't linked into any global reference
>>>>>>>>>>> system.
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????? Indeed the 'datum' moves relative to the rest of
>>>>>>>>>>> the world -
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????? but not the platform - as tide rises and falls so
>>>>>>>>>>> many would
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????? prefer to call it an 'instrument zero' rather than
>>>>>>>>>>> a 'datum'.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????? Heave is therefore a very different measurement to
>>>>>>>>>>> any sea
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????? level parameter and is the raw measurement
>>>>>>>>>>> recorded at high
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????? (Hz to kHz) frequency as a time series by floating
>>>>>>>>>>> wave
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????? instruments such as waveriders and shipborne wave
>>>>>>>>>>> recorders.
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????? It therefore cannot be sensibly described by the
>>>>>>>>>>> same or
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????? similar Standard Name as a measurement of height
>>>>>>>>>>> above a
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????? globally referenced datum like long-term mean sea
>>>>>>>>>>> level or
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????? geoid. Whilst the Standard Name could be
>>>>>>>>>>> 'platform_height_above_calm_sea_surface' or
>>>>>>>>>>> 'platform_height_above_stationary_position' I would argue that
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????? 'heave' is a term from the same domain vocabulary
>>>>>>>>>>> as 'pitch',
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????? 'roll' and 'yaw' and therefore should be used.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????? John is right to point out that the heave
>>>>>>>>>>> measurement is
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????? affected by the nature of the platform with a
>>>>>>>>>>> 250,000 tonne
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????? supertanker moving up and down much less than a
>>>>>>>>>>> rowing boat in
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????? a given wave climate, especially a wind sea. That
>>>>>>>>>>> was what was
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????? behind the SBWR corrections based on platform
>>>>>>>>>>> dimensions set
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????? up by Laurie Draper and Tom Tucker back in the 1980s.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????? Cheers, Roy.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????? From: John Helly<hellyj at ucsd.edu>
>>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:hellyj at ucsd.edu> <mailto:hellyj at ucsd.edu>
>>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:hellyj at ucsd.edu>
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????? Sent: 26 May 2018 04:48
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????? Can't let go of this yet.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????? If you think about the inverse problem of deriving
>>>>>>>>>>> the sea
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????? surface elevation from the heave you would have to
>>>>>>>>>>> account for
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????? the latency of ship motion relative to the
>>>>>>>>>>> sea-surface. A
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????? wave passing under a ship induces motions that are
>>>>>>>>>>> not
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????? instantaneous either in attack or decay.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????? J.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????? On 5/25/18 20:42, John Helly wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????? I believe it's a synonym within the oceanographic
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????? community for the vertical motion of an
>>>>>>>>>>> ocean-going platform.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ship_motions
>>>>>>>>>>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__en.wikipedia.org_wiki_Ship-5Fmotions&d=DwMDaQ&c=qKdtBuuu6dQK9MsRUVJ2DPXW6oayO8fu4TfEHS8sGNk&r=Vm7o2ZGxPkkqRuPs8nVMVQ&m=fsDk1eg5rM-so0h_XCTK_Pl1w5MGnQK88vuvHcbhUUI&s=gxXkUfvVSqtWNEzxwyAeuKgEMzADzXWv2OOZtOBRAao&e=>
>>>>>>>>>>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__en.wikipedia.org_wiki_Ship-5Fmotions&d=DwMDaQ&c=qKdtBuuu6dQK9MsRUVJ2DPXW6oayO8fu4TfEHS8sGNk&r=Vm7o2ZGxPkkqRuPs8nVMVQ&m=fsDk1eg5rM-so0h_XCTK_Pl1w5MGnQK88vuvHcbhUUI&s=gxXkUfvVSqtWNEzxwyAeuKgEMzADzXWv2OOZtOBRAao&e=>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????? Ship motions - Wikipedia
>>>>>>>>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ship_motions>
>>>>>>>>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ship_motions>
>>>>>>>>>>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__en.wikipedia.org_wiki_Ship-5Fmotions&d=DwMDaQ&c=qKdtBuuu6dQK9MsRUVJ2DPXW6oayO8fu4TfEHS8sGNk&r=Vm7o2ZGxPkkqRuPs8nVMVQ&m=fsDk1eg5rM-so0h_XCTK_Pl1w5MGnQK88vuvHcbhUUI&s=gxXkUfvVSqtWNEzxwyAeuKgEMzADzXWv2OOZtOBRAao&e=>
>>>>>>>>>>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__en.wikipedia.org_wiki_Ship-5Fmotions&d=DwMDaQ&c=qKdtBuuu6dQK9MsRUVJ2DPXW6oayO8fu4TfEHS8sGNk&r=Vm7o2ZGxPkkqRuPs8nVMVQ&m=fsDk1eg5rM-so0h_XCTK_Pl1w5MGnQK88vuvHcbhUUI&s=gxXkUfvVSqtWNEzxwyAeuKgEMzADzXWv2OOZtOBRAao&e=><https://en.wikipedia.org/
>>>>>>>>>>> wiki/Ship_motions>
>>>>>>>>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ship_motions>
>>>>>>>>>>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__en.wikipedia.org_wiki_Ship-5Fmotions&d=DwMDaQ&c=qKdtBuuu6dQK9MsRUVJ2DPXW6oayO8fu4TfEHS8sGNk&r=Vm7o2ZGxPkkqRuPs8nVMVQ&m=fsDk1eg5rM-so0h_XCTK_Pl1w5MGnQK88vuvHcbhUUI&s=gxXkUfvVSqtWNEzxwyAeuKgEMzADzXWv2OOZtOBRAao&e=>
>>>>>>>>>>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__en.wikipedia.org_wiki_Ship-5Fmotions&d=DwMDaQ&c=qKdtBuuu6dQK9MsRUVJ2DPXW6oayO8fu4TfEHS8sGNk&r=Vm7o2ZGxPkkqRuPs8nVMVQ&m=fsDk1eg5rM-so0h_XCTK_Pl1w5MGnQK88vuvHcbhUUI&s=gxXkUfvVSqtWNEzxwyAeuKgEMzADzXWv2OOZtOBRAao&e=>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????? en.wikipedia.org
>>>>>>>>>>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__en.wikipedia.org_&d=DwMFaQ&c=qKdtBuuu6dQK9MsRUVJ2DPXW6oayO8fu4TfEHS8sGNk&r=Vm7o2ZGxPkkqRuPs8nVMVQ&m=J2x5E3dUpn954rPN8-v-TFQOZiyobvfd2MaoRgJ8_Zg&s=vxsAvAgVXgUOS72MntIS3EeYgiYMynA6M4SbIbilSDk&e=>
>>>>>>>>>>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__en.wikipedia.org_&d=DwMFaQ&c=qKdtBuuu6dQK9MsRUVJ2DPXW6oayO8fu4TfEHS8sGNk&r=Vm7o2ZGxPkkqRuPs8nVMVQ&m=J2x5E3dUpn954rPN8-v-TFQOZiyobvfd2MaoRgJ8_Zg&s=vxsAvAgVXgUOS72MntIS3EeYgiYMynA6M4SbIbilSDk&e=>
>>>>>>>>>>> <http://en.wikipedia.org> <http://en.wikipedia.org>
>>>>>>>>>>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__en.wikipedia.org&d=DwMDaQ&c=qKdtBuuu6dQK9MsRUVJ2DPXW6oayO8fu4TfEHS8sGNk&r=Vm7o2ZGxPkkqRuPs8nVMVQ&m=fsDk1eg5rM-so0h_XCTK_Pl1w5MGnQK88vuvHcbhUUI&s=tpfIR7_HY7_jSNmPjinu0I6CgCY2PCb65KOJTYnwrFg&e=>
>>>>>>>>>>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__en.wikipedia.org&d=DwMDaQ&c=qKdtBuuu6dQK9MsRUVJ2DPXW6oayO8fu4TfEHS8sGNk&r=Vm7o2ZGxPkkqRuPs8nVMVQ&m=fsDk1eg5rM-so0h_XCTK_Pl1w5MGnQK88vuvHcbhUUI&s=tpfIR7_HY7_jSNmPjinu0I6CgCY2PCb65KOJTYnwrFg&e=><http://en.wikipedia.org>
>>>>>>>>>>> <http://en.wikipedia.org>
>>>>>>>>>>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__en.wikipedia.org&d=DwMDaQ&c=qKdtBuuu6dQK9MsRUVJ2DPXW6oayO8fu4TfEHS8sGNk&r=Vm7o2ZGxPkkqRuPs8nVMVQ&m=fsDk1eg5rM-so0h_XCTK_Pl1w5MGnQK88vuvHcbhUUI&s=tpfIR7_HY7_jSNmPjinu0I6CgCY2PCb65KOJTYnwrFg&e=>
>>>>>>>>>>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__en.wikipedia.org&d=DwMDaQ&c=qKdtBuuu6dQK9MsRUVJ2DPXW6oayO8fu4TfEHS8sGNk&r=Vm7o2ZGxPkkqRuPs8nVMVQ&m=fsDk1eg5rM-so0h_XCTK_Pl1w5MGnQK88vuvHcbhUUI&s=tpfIR7_HY7_jSNmPjinu0I6CgCY2PCb65KOJTYnwrFg&e=>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????? Ship motions are defined by the six degrees of
>>>>>>>>>>> freedom
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????? that a ship, boat or any other craft can
>>>>>>>>>>> experience.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????? Could just be jargon but it strike me as more
>>>>>>>>>>> complex:
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????? nonetheless a vertical position relative to a
>>>>>>>>>>> datum, but
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????? the buoyancy, stability and momentum of the
>>>>>>>>>>> platform are
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????? implied as part of the dynamics.? It seems
>>>>>>>>>>> that the datum
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????? is not a geophysical one alone but confounded
>>>>>>>>>>> with the
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????? 'normal' waterline for a platform so it may be
>>>>>>>>>>> relative to
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????? the water level in which the platform is
>>>>>>>>>>> embedded. That's
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????? a tough one. Two different platforms on the
>>>>>>>>>>> same sea
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????? surface would have different 'heave', for
>>>>>>>>>>> example.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????? J.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????? On 5/25/18 19:54, Jim Biard wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????? Hi.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????? I get and endorse the need for pitch,
>>>>>>>>>>> roll, and yaw,
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????? but I remain perplexed about heave. How is
>>>>>>>>>>> a time
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????? series of 'heave' different from a time
>>>>>>>>>>> series of
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????? height relative to some vertical datum?
>>>>>>>>>>> I've yet to
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????? see a proposed definition that convinces
>>>>>>>>>>> me that this
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????? is a uniquely different quantity.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????? Grace and peace,
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????? Jim
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????? On Fri, May 25, 2018 at 7:28 AM, Lowry,
>>>>>>>>>>> Roy K.
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????? <rkl at bodc.ac.uk <mailto:rkl at bodc.ac.uk>
>>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:rkl at bodc.ac.uk>
>>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:rkl at bodc.ac.uk><mailto:rkl at bodc.ac.uk>
>>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:rkl at bodc.ac.uk> <mailto:rkl at bodc.ac.uk>
>>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:rkl at bodc.ac.uk> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? Dear All,
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? I agree with Nan that definitions of
>>>>>>>>>>> pitch roll
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? and yaw would improve the existing
>>>>>>>>>>> Standard Name
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? definitions. I also agree with using
>>>>>>>>>>> the existing
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? orientation Standard Names for ADCPs
>>>>>>>>>>> and that the
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? 'platform' definition wording could
>>>>>>>>>>> make this
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? clearer. However, such an enhancements
>>>>>>>>>>> should be
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? submitted as a separate proposal and
>>>>>>>>>>> not be
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? considered as part of Steve's proposal.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? Cheers, Roy.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? From:? Nan
>>>>>>>>>>> Galbraith<ngalbraith at whoi.edu> <mailto:ngalbraith at whoi.edu>
>>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:ngalbraith at whoi.edu> <mailto:ngalbraith at whoi.edu>
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? Sent: 25 May 2018 14:46
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? I'd really like to see pitch, roll and
>>>>>>>>>>> yaw defined
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? in the CF standard name table; currently
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? the definitions only say 'Standard
>>>>>>>>>>> names for
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? platform describe the motion and
>>>>>>>>>>> orientation
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? of the vehicle from which observations
>>>>>>>>>>> are made
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? e.g. aeroplane, ship or satellite.'
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? Also, not to get too far into the
>>>>>>>>>>> weeds, but many
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? of the platform terms are important
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? for instruments like ADCPs, so I'd
>>>>>>>>>>> just like to
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? confirm that these definitions - and
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? the names themselves - can be used to
>>>>>>>>>>> describe
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? instruments, not just vehicles
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? 'e.g. aeroplane, ship or satellite'.
>>>>>>>>>>> We already
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? use pitch roll and yaw for these
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? instruments on surface moorings, and I
>>>>>>>>>>> hope (and
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? assume) this is legal.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? Thanks - Nan Galbraith
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? On 5/25/18 8:53 AM, Lowry, Roy K. wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? >
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? >
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? > Dear Steve,
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? >
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? >
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? > One of the reasons I was interested
>>>>>>>>>>> in your
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? definitions was your
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? > perspective on the datum (i.e. zero
>>>>>>>>>>> value) for
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? heave. The datum
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? > 'mean_sea_level' is well used in CF,
>>>>>>>>>>> but with
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? the definition 'time
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? > mean of sea surface elevation at a
>>>>>>>>>>> given
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? location over an arbitrary
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? > period sufficient to eliminate the
>>>>>>>>>>> tidal
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? signals.' This is obviously
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? > not appropriate for platform heave
>>>>>>>>>>> which doesn't
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? take any account of
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? > the state of the tide and so I would
>>>>>>>>>>> exclude
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? 'mean_sea_level' from the
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? > Standard Name.
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? >
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? >
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? > I think my preference would be to
>>>>>>>>>>> keep the term
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? 'heave' as we already
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? > have 'pitch', 'yaw' and 'roll', giving:
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? >
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? >
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? > platform_heave (m)
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? >
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? >
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? > Standard names for platform describe
>>>>>>>>>>> the motion
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? and orientation of the
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? > vehicle from which observations are
>>>>>>>>>>> made e.g.
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? aeroplane, ship or
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? > satellite. "Heave" is a term used to
>>>>>>>>>>> describe
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? the vertical
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? > displacement of the platform above
>>>>>>>>>>> its position
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? when not moving.
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? >
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? >
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? > tendency_of_platform_heave (m s-1)
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? >
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? >
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? > Standard names for platform describe
>>>>>>>>>>> the motion
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? and orientation of the
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? > vehicle from which observations are
>>>>>>>>>>> made e.g.
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? aeroplane, ship or
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? > satellite. "Tendency_of_X" means
>>>>>>>>>>> derivative of X
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? with respect to time.
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? > "Heave" is a term used to describe
>>>>>>>>>>> the vertical
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? displacement of the
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? > platform above its position when not
>>>>>>>>>>> moving.
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? >
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? >
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? > What do you think?
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? >
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? >
>>>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? > Cheers, Roy.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>> *******************************************************
>>>>>>>>>> * Nan Galbraith??????? Information Systems Specialist *
>>>>>>>>>> * Upper Ocean Processes Group Mail Stop 29 *
>>>>>>>>>> * Woods Hole Oceanographic Institution??????????????? *
>>>>>>>>>> * Woods Hole, MA 02543 (508) 289-2444 *
>>>>>>>>>> *******************************************************
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>> CF-metadata mailing list
>>>>>>>>>> CF-metadata at cgd.ucar.edu <mailto:CF-metadata at cgd.ucar.edu>
>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:CF-metadata at cgd.ucar.edu>
>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:CF-metadata at cgd.ucar.edu>
>>>>>>>>>> http://mailman.cgd.ucar.edu/mailman/listinfo/cf-metadata
>>>>>>>>>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__mailman.cgd.ucar.edu_mailman_listinfo_cf-2Dmetadata&d=DwMDaQ&c=qKdtBuuu6dQK9MsRUVJ2DPXW6oayO8fu4TfEHS8sGNk&r=Vm7o2ZGxPkkqRuPs8nVMVQ&m=fsDk1eg5rM-so0h_XCTK_Pl1w5MGnQK88vuvHcbhUUI&s=CiiBFNLLM7XQeXxCJzRPmC0xdxNR8BhH_tI-syw7_5k&e=>
>>>>>>>>>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__mailman.cgd.ucar.edu_mailman_listinfo_cf-2Dmetadata&d=DwMDaQ&c=qKdtBuuu6dQK9MsRUVJ2DPXW6oayO8fu4TfEHS8sGNk&r=Vm7o2ZGxPkkqRuPs8nVMVQ&m=fsDk1eg5rM-so0h_XCTK_Pl1w5MGnQK88vuvHcbhUUI&s=CiiBFNLLM7XQeXxCJzRPmC0xdxNR8BhH_tI-syw7_5k&e=>
>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>> CF-metadata mailing list
>>>>>>>>>> CF-metadata at cgd.ucar.edu <mailto:CF-metadata at cgd.ucar.edu>
>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:CF-metadata at cgd.ucar.edu>
>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:CF-metadata at cgd.ucar.edu>
>>>>>>>>>> http://mailman.cgd.ucar.edu/mailman/listinfo/cf-metadata
>>>>>>>>>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__mailman.cgd.ucar.edu_mailman_listinfo_cf-2Dmetadata&d=DwMDaQ&c=qKdtBuuu6dQK9MsRUVJ2DPXW6oayO8fu4TfEHS8sGNk&r=Vm7o2ZGxPkkqRuPs8nVMVQ&m=fsDk1eg5rM-so0h_XCTK_Pl1w5MGnQK88vuvHcbhUUI&s=CiiBFNLLM7XQeXxCJzRPmC0xdxNR8BhH_tI-syw7_5k&e=>
>>>>>>>>>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__mailman.cgd.ucar.edu_mailman_listinfo_cf-2Dmetadata&d=DwMDaQ&c=qKdtBuuu6dQK9MsRUVJ2DPXW6oayO8fu4TfEHS8sGNk&r=Vm7o2ZGxPkkqRuPs8nVMVQ&m=fsDk1eg5rM-so0h_XCTK_Pl1w5MGnQK88vuvHcbhUUI&s=CiiBFNLLM7XQeXxCJzRPmC0xdxNR8BhH_tI-syw7_5k&e=>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>> CF-metadata mailing list
>>>>>>>>>> CF-metadata at cgd.ucar.edu <mailto:CF-metadata at cgd.ucar.edu>
>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:CF-metadata at cgd.ucar.edu>
>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:CF-metadata at cgd.ucar.edu>
>>>>>>>>>> http://mailman.cgd.ucar.edu/mailman/listinfo/cf-metadata
>>>>>>>>>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__mailman.cgd.ucar.edu_mailman_listinfo_cf-2Dmetadata&d=DwMDaQ&c=qKdtBuuu6dQK9MsRUVJ2DPXW6oayO8fu4TfEHS8sGNk&r=Vm7o2ZGxPkkqRuPs8nVMVQ&m=fsDk1eg5rM-so0h_XCTK_Pl1w5MGnQK88vuvHcbhUUI&s=CiiBFNLLM7XQeXxCJzRPmC0xdxNR8BhH_tI-syw7_5k&e=>
>>>>>>>>>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__mailman.cgd.ucar.edu_mailman_listinfo_cf-2Dmetadata&d=DwMDaQ&c=qKdtBuuu6dQK9MsRUVJ2DPXW6oayO8fu4TfEHS8sGNk&r=Vm7o2ZGxPkkqRuPs8nVMVQ&m=fsDk1eg5rM-so0h_XCTK_Pl1w5MGnQK88vuvHcbhUUI&s=CiiBFNLLM7XQeXxCJzRPmC0xdxNR8BhH_tI-syw7_5k&e=>
>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>> CF-metadata mailing list
>>>>>>>>>> CF-metadata at cgd.ucar.edu <mailto:CF-metadata at cgd.ucar.edu>
>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:CF-metadata at cgd.ucar.edu>
>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:CF-metadata at cgd.ucar.edu>
>>>>>>>>>> http://mailman.cgd.ucar.edu/mailman/listinfo/cf-metadata
>>>>>>>>>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__mailman.cgd.ucar.edu_mailman_listinfo_cf-2Dmetadata&d=DwMDaQ&c=qKdtBuuu6dQK9MsRUVJ2DPXW6oayO8fu4TfEHS8sGNk&r=Vm7o2ZGxPkkqRuPs8nVMVQ&m=fsDk1eg5rM-so0h_XCTK_Pl1w5MGnQK88vuvHcbhUUI&s=CiiBFNLLM7XQeXxCJzRPmC0xdxNR8BhH_tI-syw7_5k&e=>
>>>>>>>>>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__mailman.cgd.ucar.edu_mailman_listinfo_cf-2Dmetadata&d=DwMDaQ&c=qKdtBuuu6dQK9MsRUVJ2DPXW6oayO8fu4TfEHS8sGNk&r=Vm7o2ZGxPkkqRuPs8nVMVQ&m=fsDk1eg5rM-so0h_XCTK_Pl1w5MGnQK88vuvHcbhUUI&s=CiiBFNLLM7XQeXxCJzRPmC0xdxNR8BhH_tI-syw7_5k&e=>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>> CICS-NC
>>>>>>>>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.cicsnc.org_&d=DwMDaQ&c=qKdtBuuu6dQK9MsRUVJ2DPXW6oayO8fu4TfEHS8sGNk&r=Vm7o2ZGxPkkqRuPs8nVMVQ&m=fsDk1eg5rM-so0h_XCTK_Pl1w5MGnQK88vuvHcbhUUI&s=8lHJz6dH2XHkNWXpzlPzw9Vx2dTDwQ5Ow4uXUIZBPZU&e=>
>>>>>>>>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.cicsnc.org_&d=DwMDaQ&c=qKdtBuuu6dQK9MsRUVJ2DPXW6oayO8fu4TfEHS8sGNk&r=Vm7o2ZGxPkkqRuPs8nVMVQ&m=fsDk1eg5rM-so0h_XCTK_Pl1w5MGnQK88vuvHcbhUUI&s=8lHJz6dH2XHkNWXpzlPzw9Vx2dTDwQ5Ow4uXUIZBPZU&e=>Visit
>>>>>>>>> us on
>>>>>>>>> Facebook
>>>>>>>>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.facebook.com_cicsnc&d=DwMDaQ&c=qKdtBuuu6dQK9MsRUVJ2DPXW6oayO8fu4TfEHS8sGNk&r=Vm7o2ZGxPkkqRuPs8nVMVQ&m=fsDk1eg5rM-so0h_XCTK_Pl1w5MGnQK88vuvHcbhUUI&s=oNLIHSVmCaO1TkAm6PFzxmtZ9Wz1oyQ9pzpsG7e3obE&e=>
>>>>>>>>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.facebook.com_cicsnc&d=DwMDaQ&c=qKdtBuuu6dQK9MsRUVJ2DPXW6oayO8fu4TfEHS8sGNk&r=Vm7o2ZGxPkkqRuPs8nVMVQ&m=fsDk1eg5rM-so0h_XCTK_Pl1w5MGnQK88vuvHcbhUUI&s=oNLIHSVmCaO1TkAm6PFzxmtZ9Wz1oyQ9pzpsG7e3obE&e=>
>>>>>>>>> ????*Jim Biard*
>>>>>>>>> *Research Scholar*
>>>>>>>>> Cooperative Institute for Climate and Satellites
>>>>>>>>> NC<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__cicsnc.org_&d=DwMDaQ&c=qKdtBuuu6dQK9MsRUVJ2DPXW6oayO8fu4TfEHS8sGNk&r=Vm7o2ZGxPkkqRuPs8nVMVQ&m=fsDk1eg5rM-so0h_XCTK_Pl1w5MGnQK88vuvHcbhUUI&s=J44MNoS3a3tRZadexG7eUT9VHnim-C1Q38Gg053klgA&e=>
>>>>>>>>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__cicsnc.org_&d=DwMDaQ&c=qKdtBuuu6dQK9MsRUVJ2DPXW6oayO8fu4TfEHS8sGNk&r=Vm7o2ZGxPkkqRuPs8nVMVQ&m=fsDk1eg5rM-so0h_XCTK_Pl1w5MGnQK88vuvHcbhUUI&s=J44MNoS3a3tRZadexG7eUT9VHnim-C1Q38Gg053klgA&e=>
>>>>>>>>> North Carolina State
>>>>>>>>> University<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__ncsu.edu_&d=DwMDaQ&c=qKdtBuuu6dQK9MsRUVJ2DPXW6oayO8fu4TfEHS8sGNk&r=Vm7o2ZGxPkkqRuPs8nVMVQ&m=fsDk1eg5rM-so0h_XCTK_Pl1w5MGnQK88vuvHcbhUUI&s=VFiaA8MAm8rNiE-oSavyuVxEWBUhGmkoZLFec_ZFYlo&e=>
>>>>>>>>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__ncsu.edu_&d=DwMDaQ&c=qKdtBuuu6dQK9MsRUVJ2DPXW6oayO8fu4TfEHS8sGNk&r=Vm7o2ZGxPkkqRuPs8nVMVQ&m=fsDk1eg5rM-so0h_XCTK_Pl1w5MGnQK88vuvHcbhUUI&s=VFiaA8MAm8rNiE-oSavyuVxEWBUhGmkoZLFec_ZFYlo&e=>
>>>>>>>>> NOAA National Centers for Environmental
>>>>>>>>> Information<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__ncdc.noaa.gov_&d=DwMDaQ&c=qKdtBuuu6dQK9MsRUVJ2DPXW6oayO8fu4TfEHS8sGNk&r=Vm7o2ZGxPkkqRuPs8nVMVQ&m=fsDk1eg5rM-so0h_XCTK_Pl1w5MGnQK88vuvHcbhUUI&s=F-xQ7THSSP276ClTb8arUk9hFLSJ8wJhSEKZwbfQNVM&e=>
>>>>>>>>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__ncdc.noaa.gov_&d=DwMDaQ&c=qKdtBuuu6dQK9MsRUVJ2DPXW6oayO8fu4TfEHS8sGNk&r=Vm7o2ZGxPkkqRuPs8nVMVQ&m=fsDk1eg5rM-so0h_XCTK_Pl1w5MGnQK88vuvHcbhUUI&s=F-xQ7THSSP276ClTb8arUk9hFLSJ8wJhSEKZwbfQNVM&e=>
>>>>>>>>> /formerly NOAA?s National Climatic Data Center/
>>>>>>>>> 151 Patton Ave, Asheville, NC 28801
>>>>>>>>> e:jbiard at cicsnc.org <mailto:e:jbiard at cicsnc.org>
>>>>>>>>> <mailto:jbiard at cicsnc.org> <mailto:jbiard at cicsnc.org>
>>>>>>>>> o: +1 828 271 4900
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> /Connect with us on Facebook forclimate
>>>>>>>>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.facebook.com_NOAANCEIclimate&d=DwMDaQ&c=qKdtBuuu6dQK9MsRUVJ2DPXW6oayO8fu4TfEHS8sGNk&r=Vm7o2ZGxPkkqRuPs8nVMVQ&m=fsDk1eg5rM-so0h_XCTK_Pl1w5MGnQK88vuvHcbhUUI&s=-I3y1iTURs4K97NhqWoXlP5uoaMBi-jvEE2diIwFODg&e=>
>>>>>>>>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.facebook.com_NOAANCEIclimate&d=DwMDaQ&c=qKdtBuuu6dQK9MsRUVJ2DPXW6oayO8fu4TfEHS8sGNk&r=Vm7o2ZGxPkkqRuPs8nVMVQ&m=fsDk1eg5rM-so0h_XCTK_Pl1w5MGnQK88vuvHcbhUUI&s=-I3y1iTURs4K97NhqWoXlP5uoaMBi-jvEE2diIwFODg&e=>andocean
>>>>>>>>> and geophysics
>>>>>>>>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.facebook.com_NOAANCEIoceangeo&d=DwMDaQ&c=qKdtBuuu6dQK9MsRUVJ2DPXW6oayO8fu4TfEHS8sGNk&r=Vm7o2ZGxPkkqRuPs8nVMVQ&m=fsDk1eg5rM-so0h_XCTK_Pl1w5MGnQK88vuvHcbhUUI&s=8ApaGoSCCCRFwF6j3evIWD8um0l0N0Avdz4cny_m_Zs&e=>
>>>>>>>>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.facebook.com_NOAANCEIoceangeo&d=DwMDaQ&c=qKdtBuuu6dQK9MsRUVJ2DPXW6oayO8fu4TfEHS8sGNk&r=Vm7o2ZGxPkkqRuPs8nVMVQ&m=fsDk1eg5rM-so0h_XCTK_Pl1w5MGnQK88vuvHcbhUUI&s=8ApaGoSCCCRFwF6j3evIWD8um0l0N0Avdz4cny_m_Zs&e=>information,
>>>>>>>>> and follow us on Twitter at at NOAANCEIclimate
>>>>>>>>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__twitter.com_NOAANCEIclimate&d=DwMDaQ&c=qKdtBuuu6dQK9MsRUVJ2DPXW6oayO8fu4TfEHS8sGNk&r=Vm7o2ZGxPkkqRuPs8nVMVQ&m=fsDk1eg5rM-so0h_XCTK_Pl1w5MGnQK88vuvHcbhUUI&s=zpNjm0rVsNRvcMCt5onLOEFwqoxJwb1z4nrtZXIDOn0&e=>
>>>>>>>>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__twitter.com_NOAANCEIclimate&d=DwMDaQ&c=qKdtBuuu6dQK9MsRUVJ2DPXW6oayO8fu4TfEHS8sGNk&r=Vm7o2ZGxPkkqRuPs8nVMVQ&m=fsDk1eg5rM-so0h_XCTK_Pl1w5MGnQK88vuvHcbhUUI&s=zpNjm0rVsNRvcMCt5onLOEFwqoxJwb1z4nrtZXIDOn0&e=>and at NOAANCEIocngeo
>>>>>>>>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__twitter.com_NOAANCEIocngeo&d=DwMDaQ&c=qKdtBuuu6dQK9MsRUVJ2DPXW6oayO8fu4TfEHS8sGNk&r=Vm7o2ZGxPkkqRuPs8nVMVQ&m=fsDk1eg5rM-so0h_XCTK_Pl1w5MGnQK88vuvHcbhUUI&s=GcsHw9fQDVUMabWDrGLrdXOZLmCJ5UWXcapPHOUcwdE&e=>
>>>>>>>>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__twitter.com_NOAANCEIocngeo&d=DwMDaQ&c=qKdtBuuu6dQK9MsRUVJ2DPXW6oayO8fu4TfEHS8sGNk&r=Vm7o2ZGxPkkqRuPs8nVMVQ&m=fsDk1eg5rM-so0h_XCTK_Pl1w5MGnQK88vuvHcbhUUI&s=GcsHw9fQDVUMabWDrGLrdXOZLmCJ5UWXcapPHOUcwdE&e=>./
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>> CF-metadata mailing list
>>>>>>>>> CF-metadata at cgd.ucar.edu <mailto:CF-metadata at cgd.ucar.edu>
>>>>>>>>> <mailto:CF-metadata at cgd.ucar.edu>
>>>>>>>>> <mailto:CF-metadata at cgd.ucar.edu>
>>>>>>>>> http://mailman.cgd.ucar.edu/mailman/listinfo/cf-metadata
>>>>>>>>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__mailman.cgd.ucar.edu_mailman_listinfo_cf-2Dmetadata&d=DwMFaQ&c=qKdtBuuu6dQK9MsRUVJ2DPXW6oayO8fu4TfEHS8sGNk&r=Vm7o2ZGxPkkqRuPs8nVMVQ&m=J2x5E3dUpn954rPN8-v-TFQOZiyobvfd2MaoRgJ8_Zg&s=7WZod_Yl4Ny2ikX4Vb__7Og8ciU0cQVZe4z5EPcKMe0&e=>
>>>>>>>>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__mailman.cgd.ucar.edu_mailman_listinfo_cf-2Dmetadata&d=DwMFaQ&c=qKdtBuuu6dQK9MsRUVJ2DPXW6oayO8fu4TfEHS8sGNk&r=Vm7o2ZGxPkkqRuPs8nVMVQ&m=J2x5E3dUpn954rPN8-v-TFQOZiyobvfd2MaoRgJ8_Zg&s=7WZod_Yl4Ny2ikX4Vb__7Og8ciU0cQVZe4z5EPcKMe0&e=>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>> Kenneth E. Kehoe
>>>>>>>> ?? Research Associate - University of Oklahoma
>>>>>>>> ?? Cooperative Institute for Mesoscale Meteorological Studies
>>>>>>>> ?? ARM Climate Research Facility - Data Quality Office
>>>>>>>> e-mail:kkehoe at ou.edu <mailto:e-mail:kkehoe at ou.edu>
>>>>>>>> <mailto:kkehoe at ou.edu> <mailto:kkehoe at ou.edu>? | Office:
>>>>>>>> 303-497-4754 | Cell: 405-826-0299
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> Kenneth E. Kehoe
>>>>
>>>
>>
>> --
>> Kenneth E. Kehoe
>> Research Associate - University of Oklahoma
>> Cooperative Institute for Mesoscale Meteorological Studies
>> ARM Climate Research Facility - Data Quality Office
>> e-mail:kkehoe at ou.edu <mailto:kkehoe at ou.edu> | Office: 303-497-4754 | Cell: 405-826-0299
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> CF-metadata mailing list
>> CF-metadata at cgd.ucar.edu <mailto:CF-metadata at cgd.ucar.edu>
>> http://mailman.cgd.ucar.edu/mailman/listinfo/cf-metadata
>
> --
> CICS-NC <http://www.cicsnc.org/>Visit us on
> Facebook <http://www.facebook.com/cicsnc> *Jim Biard*
> *Research Scholar*
> Cooperative Institute for Climate and Satellites NC <http://cicsnc.org/>
> North Carolina State University <http://ncsu.edu/>
> NOAA National Centers for Environmental Information
> <http://ncdc.noaa.gov/>
> /formerly NOAA?s National Climatic Data Center/
> 151 Patton Ave, Asheville, NC 28801
> e: jbiard at cicsnc.org <mailto:jbiard at cicsnc.org>
> o: +1 828 271 4900
>
> /Connect with us on Facebook for climate
> <https://www.facebook.com/NOAANCEIclimate> and ocean and geophysics
> <https://www.facebook.com/NOAANCEIoceangeo> information, and follow us
> on Twitter at _at_NOAANCEIclimate <https://twitter.com/NOAANCEIclimate>
> and _at_NOAANCEIocngeo <https://twitter.com/NOAANCEIocngeo>. /
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
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--
CICS-NC <http://www.cicsnc.org/> Visit us on
Facebook <http://www.facebook.com/cicsnc> *Jim Biard*
*Research Scholar*
Cooperative Institute for Climate and Satellites NC <http://cicsnc.org/>
North Carolina State University <http://ncsu.edu/>
NOAA National Centers for Environmental Information <http://ncdc.noaa.gov/>
/formerly NOAA?s National Climatic Data Center/
151 Patton Ave, Asheville, NC 28801
e: jbiard at cicsnc.org <mailto:jbiard at cicsnc.org>
o: +1 828 271 4900
/Connect with us on Facebook for climate
<https://www.facebook.com/NOAANCEIclimate> and ocean and geophysics
<https://www.facebook.com/NOAANCEIoceangeo> information, and follow us
on Twitter at _at_NOAANCEIclimate <https://twitter.com/NOAANCEIclimate> and
_at_NOAANCEIocngeo <https://twitter.com/NOAANCEIocngeo>. /
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