Nan,
I guess the difference (platform_orientation - platform_course) is
approximately platform_yaw, although it might include any "at rest" crab
(yaw). It is a different-enough quantity that I think it probably
deserves to stay.
Grace and peace,
Jim
On 8/2/18 11:29 AM, Nan Galbraith wrote:
> Thank you, Jim, well done.
>
> My only concern is that platform_orientation is describing the same angle
> as yaw, and maybe should be deprecated.? The web is full of references to
> 'platform orientation', and a very quick check tells me they (mainly)
> refer to
> all 3 axes.
>
> I tried to check the sign of roll for ADCPs, since this is a variable
> that's output
> by the Teledyne-RDIs that we use, but I don't have the time to do a
> thorough job
> at this point. If different communities define this differently, Maybe
> we'll need to
> consider using an attribute.
>
> Cheers - Nan
>
> On 8/2/18 5:01 AM, Lowry, Roy K. wrote:
>>
>> Dear All,
>>
>>
>> You're not going to believe this, but try Googling 'pitch roll yaw'
>> and look through the images at the?roll sign convention. This reveals
>> some inconsistency on whether?positive roll is clockwise when looking
>> forward (Jim's definition)?or looking backward (Ken's definition).
>>
>>
>> My personal experience from going to sea was that positive roll was
>> port to?starboard?- i.e. clockwise when looking forward. I'm pretty
>> sure the roll data?streams we handle (Autosub and gliders)
>> also?conform to this convention, but will ask somebody to check.
>>
>>
>> Could I suggest that Ken also?check his definition sources and data
>> streams.
>>
>>
>> Cheers, Roy.
>>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> *From:* CF-metadata <cf-metadata-bounces at cgd.ucar.edu> on behalf of
>> Kenneth Kehoe <kkehoe at ou.edu>
>> *Sent:* 01 August 2018 22:51
>> *To:* cf-metadata at cgd.ucar.edu
>> *Subject:* Re: [CF-metadata] Platform Heave
>> Sounds good to me except the platform_roll positive direction seems
>> to be opposite of what we have been describing. I typically have
>> platform roll positive for right-hand side rising.
>>
>> Ken
>>
>>
>> On 2018-8-1 13:55, Jim Biard wrote:
>>>
>>> Hi.
>>>
>>>
>>> Here is my proposal for a self-consistent and generic set of
>>> definitions for roll, pitch, yaw, surge, sway, heave, course, and
>>> orientation. I've tried to avoid lots of reference frame or vector
>>> terms, basing everything on the vertical direction and the nominal
>>> forward motion direction, which are two things all the moving
>>> platforms we are concerned with have, and which I think are easy
>>> enough to extrapolate to a stationary platform. I haven't bothered
>>> to do the *_rate definitions, since they are simple extrapolations
>>> of these definitions.
>>>
>>> I have taken the liberty of removing the redundant word "angle" from
>>> the definitions of roll, pitch, and yaw. It is like using "latitude
>>> angle" for latitude or "course angle" for course. We can make the
>>> redundant formulations aliases of the proper ones.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> *
>>>
>>> platform_roll: Roll is a rotation about an axis (the X axis) that is
>>> perpendicular to the local vertical axis (the Z axis) and is
>>> coplanar with the nominal forward motion direction for the platform.
>>> The rotation is positive clockwise about that axis when seen from
>>> behind the platform looking towards it (e.g. right-hand side
>>> falling), and relative to the ?at rest? rotation of the platform
>>> with respect to the X axis. Platform is a structure or vehicle that
>>> serves as a base for mounting sensors. Platforms include, but are
>>> not limited to, satellites, aeroplanes, ships, buoys, ground
>>> stations, and masts.
>>>
>>> **
>>>
>>> *
>>> *
>>>
>>> platform_pitch: Pitch is a rotation about an axis (the Y axis) that
>>> is perpendicular to both the local vertical axis (the Z axis) and
>>> the nominal forward motion direction for the platform. The rotation
>>> is positive clockwise about that axis when seen from the left of the
>>> platform looking towards it (e.g. front end rising), and relative to
>>> the ?at rest? rotation of the platform with respect to the Y axis.
>>> Platform is a structure or vehicle that serves as a base for
>>> mounting sensors. Platforms include, but are not limited to,
>>> satellites, aeroplanes, ships, buoys, ground stations, and masts.
>>>
>>> **
>>>
>>> *
>>> *
>>>
>>> platform_yaw: Yaw is a rotation about the local vertical axis (the Z
>>> axis). The rotation is positive clockwise about that axis when seen
>>> from above the platform looking towards it (e.g. front end turning
>>> to the right), and relative to the ?at rest? rotation of the
>>> platform with respect to the Z axis. Platform is a structure or
>>> vehicle that serves as a base for mounting sensors. Platforms
>>> include, but are not limited to, satellites, aeroplanes, ships,
>>> buoys, ground stations, and masts.
>>>
>>> **
>>>
>>> *
>>> *
>>>
>>> platform_surge: Surge is a displacement along an axis (the X axis)
>>> that is perpendicular to the local vertical axis (the Z axis) and is
>>> coplanar with the nominal forward motion direction for the platform.
>>> The displacement is positive for motion of the platform in the
>>> nominal forward motion direction (e.g. forward motion), and relative
>>> to the ?at rest? position of the platform with respect to the X
>>> axis. The ?at rest? position of the platform may change over time.
>>> Platform is a structure or vehicle that serves as a base for
>>> mounting sensors. Platforms include, but are not limited to,
>>> satellites, aeroplanes, ships, buoys, ground stations, and masts.
>>>
>>> **
>>>
>>> *
>>> *
>>>
>>> platform_sway: Sway is a displacement along an axis (the Y axis)
>>> that is perpendicular to both the local vertical axis (the Z axis)
>>> and the nominal forward motion direction for the platform. The
>>> displacement is positive for motion of the platform to the right of
>>> the nominal forward motion direction when seen from behind the
>>> platform looking towards it (e.g. rightward motion), and relative to
>>> the ?at rest? position of the platform with respect to the Y axis.
>>> The ?at rest? position of the platform may change over time.
>>> Platform is a structure or vehicle that serves as a base for
>>> mounting sensors. Platforms include, but are not limited to,
>>> satellites, aeroplanes, ships, buoys, ground stations, and masts.
>>>
>>> **
>>>
>>> *
>>> *
>>>
>>> platform_heave: Heave is a displacement along the local vertical
>>> axis (the Z axis). The displacement is positive for upward motion of
>>> the platform, and relative to the ?at rest? position of the platform
>>> with respect to the Z axis. The ?at rest? position of the platform
>>> may change over time. Platform is a structure or vehicle that serves
>>> as a base for mounting sensors. Platforms include, but are not
>>> limited to, satellites, aeroplanes, ships, buoys, ground stations,
>>> and masts.
>>>
>>> **
>>>
>>> *
>>> *
>>>
>>> platform_course: Course is the clockwise angle with respect to North
>>> of the nominal forward motion direction of the platform. Platform is
>>> a structure or vehicle that serves as a base for mounting sensors.
>>> Platforms include, but are not limited to, satellites, aeroplanes,
>>> ships, buoys, ground stations, and masts.
>>>
>>> **
>>>
>>> *
>>> *
>>>
>>> platform_orientation: Orientation is the clockwise angle with
>>> respect to North of the longitudinal (front-to-back) axis of the
>>> platform, which may be different than the platform course (see
>>> platform_course).*Platforms include, but are not limited to,
>>> satellites, aeroplanes, ships, buoys, ground stations, and masts.*
>>>
>>> *
>>> Grace and peace,
>>>
>>> Jim
>>>
>>> On 7/31/18 3:29 AM, Lowry, Roy K. wrote:
>>>>
>>>> On second thoughts removing the underscores is more elegant
>>>> correction than adding 'platform'.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Cheers, Roy.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I have now retired but will continue to be active through an
>>>> Emeritus Fellowship using this e-mail address.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>
>>>> *From:* CF-metadata <cf-metadata-bounces at cgd.ucar.edu>
>>>> <mailto:cf-metadata-bounces at cgd.ucar.edu> on behalf of Lowry, Roy
>>>> K. <rkl at bodc.ac.uk> <mailto:rkl at bodc.ac.uk>
>>>> *Sent:* 30 July 2018 18:49
>>>> *To:* Kenneth Kehoe
>>>> *Cc:* CF Metadata List
>>>> *Subject:* Re: [CF-metadata] Platform Heave
>>>>
>>>> Hi Ken,
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> You're absolutely right - should have been platform_yaw_angle.
>>>> Getting the detail spot on in these things isn't easy, which is why
>>>> we have discussion lists!
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> With the way I'm currently seeing things?I don't agree that pitch
>>>> and roll affect the definition of heave. They are only factors that
>>>> come into account with the coupling of heave into the next level of
>>>> the CRS hierarchy.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Cheers, Roy.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I have now retired but will continue to be active through an
>>>> Emeritus Fellowship using this e-mail address.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>
>>>> *From:* CF-metadata <cf-metadata-bounces at cgd.ucar.edu>
>>>> <mailto:cf-metadata-bounces at cgd.ucar.edu> on behalf of Kenneth
>>>> Kehoe <kkehoe at ou.edu> <mailto:kkehoe at ou.edu>
>>>> *Sent:* 30 July 2018 18:39
>>>> *Cc:* CF Metadata List
>>>> *Subject:* Re: [CF-metadata] Platform Heave
>>>> I agree with John the (keel to top of mast) statement is incorrect
>>>> when the platform is tilted. I only inserted that to help describe
>>>> the Z-axis. But I don't think it's helping. I think John is also
>>>> right on point with this since I can't find a definition of heave
>>>> that discusses the orientation of the platform and how it relates
>>>> to the measurement of heave. That is why I'm suggesting we not try
>>>> to tackle that issue. From an instrument perspective I don't think
>>>> the organization writing the measurement to file actually know all
>>>> the details of how the values are derived or the full reference
>>>> frame. I tell people to not use the standard_name definitions
>>>> unless they are positive it matches exactly, and without all the
>>>> information I don't think people will be able to use a too specific
>>>> definition. A less specific definition would allow the use now, and
>>>> a more specific definition can be added later if needed.
>>>>
>>>> I did like Roy's definition of platform_yaw_angle and
>>>> platform_yaw_rate. My only suggestion is to remove the underscore
>>>> in "yaw_angle" in the definition of platform_yaw_rate, or use the
>>>> full term "platform_yaw_angle". Otherwise it appears like a
>>>> reference to a different term.
>>>>
>>>> Ken
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On 2018-7-30 10:52, John Graybeal wrote:
>>>>> 1) Now that we have another platform_heave comment, could we
>>>>> please create a new thread for the discussion on
>>>>> pitch/roll/heading? ?Maybe starting without all the historical
>>>>> points, at least the heave-related ones? Both are difficult
>>>>> conversations to follow in sequence.
>>>>>
>>>>> 2) I have a concern about the last two heave definitions.
>>>>> ? a) "Heave is the linear motion along the vertical Z-axis (e.g.
>>>>> keel to top of mast) with positive values representing upward
>>>>> motion.?
>>>>>
>>>>> I like the thrust of this definition, it?s simple to understand.
>>>>> However I don?t think it?s measured in the direction of keel to
>>>>> top of mast of the current or recent vessel position, is it? I
>>>>> rather assume it is perpendicular to a nominally level service,
>>>>> possibly in the direction of the gravity vector. The dictionary
>>>>> definition "Heaving is the linear motion along the vertical
>>>>> Z-axis? with the positive values coda seems closer.
>>>>>
>>>>> ? b) "upwards vertical displacement of a platform over a
>>>>> measurement time interval?
>>>>>
>>>>> I can?t tell how to parse ?over? here. ?An upwards vertical
>>>>> displacement is relative to another position, and in this case I
>>>>> think that ?original? position is being measured (at least
>>>>> conceptually) during another time interval. It just needs a few
>>>>> words, something like ?of a platform when compared to its average
>>>>> vertical position over a corresponding time interface?.
>>>>>
>>>>> But I guess the fundamental issue is I can?t tell (and don?t
>>>>> actually know) what heave is determined with respect to. If my
>>>>> last 11 positions relative to average seas are 0, 1, 2, 2, 1, 4,
>>>>> 1, 2, 2, 1, 0 (think hilly!), I have no idea if the heave at the
>>>>> peak (?4?) is 4 or something else ? it just depends on when and
>>>>> how long the baseline measurement is, doesn?t it? ?(Or to put it
>>>>> another way, is the heave at the 7th point a negative number,
>>>>> since the ship just went down 3 units?) ?If someone can answer
>>>>> that then our best definition might be more obvious.
>>>>>
>>>>> John
>>>>>
>>>>> ---------------------------------------
>>>>> John Graybeal
>>>>> jbgraybeal at mindspring.com <mailto:jbgraybeal at mindspring.com>
>>>>>
>>>>>> On Jul 29, 2018, at 04:29, Lowry, Roy K. <rkl at bodc.ac.uk
>>>>>> <mailto:rkl at bodc.ac.uk>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Dear All,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Giving it some thought over the weekend I realise that where we
>>>>>> lost the plot in this discussion was when we encountered
>>>>>> 'direction of travel'. Jim succinctly described platform motion
>>>>>> with the phrase 'nested co-ordinate systems'. What I failed to
>>>>>> realise - and I'm guessing I'm not alone - is that the pitch,
>>>>>> roll, heave etc. family of terms for platform motion refer SOLELY
>>>>>> to the innermost co-ordinate reference in that nest and that the
>>>>>> 'zero' for these measurements is 'platform at rest'. This
>>>>>> innermost co-ordinate reference comprises three orthogonal axes
>>>>>> that intersect at the platform's centre of gravity. Two of these
>>>>>> are horizontal (Ken's longitudinal X-axis and transverse Y-axis)
>>>>>> and the third vertical (Ken's vertical Z-axis). Others make?no
>>>>>> attempt to treat these parameters in the same way as zenith, and
>>>>>> I now realise?CF shouldn't be any different.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Having come to terms with this, Ken's definition elements hve a
>>>>>> beautiful simplicity that?can be slotted into Alison's compound
>>>>>> definitions. My only problem is the inclusion of nautical terms
>>>>>> like 'bow' and 'stern', but these can easily be replaced by
>>>>>> generic equivalents such as 'front' and 'back'. I would also make
>>>>>> it clearer is that zero is platform at rest.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> For example the definition pair for yaw become:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> platform_yaw_angle
>>>>>> "yaw _angle"?is the amount of rotation from the rest
>>>>>> position?around the vertical Z-axis with positive values
>>>>>> resulting in clockwise motion?when viewed from above.?The
>>>>>> vertical?Z axis, also known as the "yaw axis", is an imaginary
>>>>>> line running vertically through the platform's?centre of gravity.
>>>>>> Standard names for "platform" describe the motion and orientation
>>>>>> of the vehicle from which observations are made. Platforms
>>>>>> include, but are not limited to, satellites, aeroplanes, ships,
>>>>>> instruments and buoys.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> platform_yaw_rate
>>>>>> "platform_yaw_rate" is the change per unit time of "yaw_angle".
>>>>>> "yaw _angle"?is?the amount of rotation from the rest
>>>>>> position?around the vertical Z-axis with positive values
>>>>>> resulting in clockwise motion?when viewed from above.?The
>>>>>> vertical Z axis, also known as the "yaw axis", is an imaginary
>>>>>> line running vertically through the platform's centre of gravity.
>>>>>> Standard names for "platform" describe the motion and orientation
>>>>>> of the vehicle from which observations are made. Platforms
>>>>>> include, but are not limited to, satellites, aeroplanes, ships,
>>>>>> instruments and buoys.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> How does that work for people?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Cheers, Roy.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I have now retired but will continue to be active through an
>>>>>> Emeritus Fellowship using this e-mail address.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>
>>>>>> *From:*CF-metadata <cf-metadata-bounces at cgd.ucar.edu
>>>>>> <mailto:cf-metadata-bounces at cgd.ucar.edu>> on behalf of Kenneth
>>>>>> Kehoe <kkehoe at ou.edu <mailto:kkehoe at ou.edu>>
>>>>>> *Sent:*27 July 2018 16:49
>>>>>> *To:*cf-metadata at cgd.ucar.edu <mailto:cf-metadata at cgd.ucar.edu>
>>>>>> *Subject:*Re: [CF-metadata] Platform Heave
>>>>>> All,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Sorry for joining this conversation late. This is an important
>>>>>> discussion for my group and finding a resolution would be very
>>>>>> helpful. For my purposes I only need a good definition, which
>>>>>> might coincide with the nautical definitions. For examplethis
>>>>>> reference
>>>>>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.wartsila.com_encyclopedia_term_ship-2Dmotions&d=DwMFaQ&c=qKdtBuuu6dQK9MsRUVJ2DPXW6oayO8fu4TfEHS8sGNk&r=Vm7o2ZGxPkkqRuPs8nVMVQ&m=J2x5E3dUpn954rPN8-v-TFQOZiyobvfd2MaoRgJ8_Zg&s=GnqNqW163_p5PcNhTjRgd0qwnu6cR6JuDeQvE2qaBGQ&e=>would
>>>>>> suffice for most of my needs except for the missing definition of
>>>>>> positive direction. I've asked about defining a positive
>>>>>> direction in the past using the "positive" attribute and it was
>>>>>> decided to not expand that attribute. If we can define the
>>>>>> positive direction in all the platform standard names that would
>>>>>> be great, but it should be universally existent for all current
>>>>>> and future platform definitions.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I would prefer to not get into the details of how a value is
>>>>>> derived in the definition as that is more of the cell_methods
>>>>>> domain. Also I find that confusing as heave on an ocean going
>>>>>> ship is not always measured as the difference between two GPS
>>>>>> points but could be an integration of a speed or acceleration.
>>>>>> This would result in two different measurements that depend on
>>>>>> the method, but both are correct.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I next attempted to come up with some definitions but I ended up
>>>>>> going down a wormhole of different reference frames only to
>>>>>> realize in the end my definitions will never match with the
>>>>>> values from the vendor supplied data values because my
>>>>>> definitions were becoming too specific. I can't find a definition
>>>>>> of heave that takes into account tides, large waves (water or
>>>>>> atmospheric), or orientation of the platform. They all seem to be
>>>>>> relative to the platform position some x time ago. So here is my
>>>>>> attempt at the definitions:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> platform_heave =? Heave is the linear motion along the vertical
>>>>>> Z-axis (e.g. keel to top of mast) with positive values
>>>>>> representing upward motion.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> platform_sway = Sway is the motion along the transverse Y-axis
>>>>>> (e.g. port to starboard) with positive values towards the
>>>>>> right-hand side the platform (starboard) when oriented towards
>>>>>> leading edge of the platform.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> platform_surge = Surge is the motion along the longitudinal
>>>>>> X-axis (e.g. stern to bow) with positive values indicating motion
>>>>>> towards the leading edge of the platform (bow).
>>>>>>
>>>>>> platform_roll_angle = Roll is a rotation around a longitudinal
>>>>>> X-axis with positive values resulting in counter clockwise motion
>>>>>> (e.g. right-hand side rising) when oriented towards leading edge
>>>>>> of the platform.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> platform_pitch_angle = Pitch is a rotation around the transverse
>>>>>> Y-axis with positive values resulting in counter clockwise motion
>>>>>> (e.g. leading edge of the platform rising).
>>>>>>
>>>>>> platform_yaw_angle = Yaw is a rotation around the vertical Z-axis
>>>>>> with positive values resulting in clockwise motion of the forward
>>>>>> section (bow) when viewed from above.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> platform_roll_rate = Roll rate is rotation change per unit time
>>>>>> around a longitudinal X-axis with positive values resulting in
>>>>>> counter clockwise motion (e.g. right-hand side rising) when
>>>>>> oriented towards leading edge of the platform.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> platform_pitch_rate = Pitch rate is rotation change per unit time
>>>>>> around the transverse Y-axis with positive values resulting in
>>>>>> counter clockwise motion (e.g. leading edge of the platform rising).
>>>>>>
>>>>>> platform_yaw_rate = Yaw rate is rotation change per unit time
>>>>>> around the vertical Z-axis with positive values resulting in
>>>>>> clockwise motion of the forward section (bow) when viewed from
>>>>>> above.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I know these differ from the current definitions, but I'm not
>>>>>> completely understanding how the definitions are created. Is
>>>>>> platform_orientation always prepended? Is a rate always defined
>>>>>> with the same as the angle definition but with a final sentence
>>>>>> explaining it's actually a rate?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Ken
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On 2018-7-25 09:50, Jim Biard wrote:
>>>>>>> Alison,
>>>>>>> It's a lovely nested reference frames problem, isn't it? Roll,
>>>>>>> pitch, and yaw are usually defined relative to a center of
>>>>>>> motion (CM) reference frame defined using the (mean) direction
>>>>>>> of motion and the up direction. In my (satellite-based)
>>>>>>> experience, the Y axis unit vector is defined by the normalized
>>>>>>> cross-product of the up unit vector with the direction of motion
>>>>>>> unit vector (Z x X). The X axis unit vector is then defined by
>>>>>>> the cross-product of the Y unit vector and the up unit vector (Y
>>>>>>> x Z). This means of forming the CM reference frame decouples
>>>>>>> orientation from motion. The X axis is not necessarily identical
>>>>>>> to the direction of motion. The vehicle reference frame may have
>>>>>>> fixed offsets in x, y, z, roll, pitch, and yaw relative to the
>>>>>>> CM reference frame, but in my limited experience those offsets
>>>>>>> have been zero.
>>>>>>> Platforms that aren't moving are an even more entertaining case,
>>>>>>> for sure!
>>>>>>> In the end, I'd tend towards referring to a CM or geospatial
>>>>>>> reference frame with the Z direction defined as "up" if I'm
>>>>>>> going to try and get detailed about it, as opposed to 'mean
>>>>>>> orientation'. But I only have experience with satellites (and a
>>>>>>> bit with airplanes).
>>>>>>> Grace and peace,
>>>>>>> Jim
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On 7/25/18 9:37 AM, Alison Pamment - UKRI STFC wrote:
>>>>>>>> Hi Roy and Jim,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Thanks for your quick comments on the definitions. I have just
>>>>>>>> been looking again at the suggested text for yaw_angle:
>>>>>>>> 'Platform yaw angle is the angle between the platform's
>>>>>>>> longitudinal/X axis and the direction of travel. Zero yaw angle
>>>>>>>> means the longitudinal axis is aligned with the direction of
>>>>>>>> travel, or a reference direction if the platform is stationary.
>>>>>>>> The usual sign convention is that yaw angle is measured
>>>>>>>> positive when the front or leading edge of the platform is
>>>>>>>> rotated clockwise from its orientation (which has the standard
>>>>>>>> name platform_orientation).'
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The problem is how to describe the reference direction which
>>>>>>>> the angle is calculated relative to. I started out by talking
>>>>>>>> about 'direction of travel' and later referred to
>>>>>>>> 'platform_orientation'. The definition of platform_orientation
>>>>>>>> says 'The platform orientation is the direction in which the
>>>>>>>> "front" or longitudinal axis of the platform is pointing (not
>>>>>>>> necessarily the same as the direction in which it is
>>>>>>>> travelling, called platform_course).' I've realised my new
>>>>>>>> definition doesn't really make sense if direction of travel and
>>>>>>>> orientation aren't the same (and clearly they can be
>>>>>>>> different). Also, if 'orientation' is the instantaneous
>>>>>>>> direction of the longitudinal axis, then presumably it includes
>>>>>>>> yaw angle, so it isn't the right reference for measuring yaw.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I've revised the text as follows:
>>>>>>>> 'Platform yaw angle is the angle between the platform's
>>>>>>>> longitudinal/X axis and the platform's mean orientation (i.e.
>>>>>>>> its orientation not including high frequency variations due to
>>>>>>>> swaying and rocking motions, for example, ship motions caused
>>>>>>>> by the passing of sea surface waves). Zero yaw angle means the
>>>>>>>> longitudinal axis is aligned with the mean orientation. The
>>>>>>>> usual sign convention is that yaw angle is measured positive
>>>>>>>> when the front or leading edge of the platform is rotated
>>>>>>>> clockwise from its mean orientation (which has the standard
>>>>>>>> name platform_orientation).
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Does it sound okay to refer to a 'mean orientation' in this
>>>>>>>> way? I'm having trouble thinking of a better wording!
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Best wishes,
>>>>>>>> Alison
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ------
>>>>>>>> Alison Pamment???????????????????????????????? Tel: +44 1235
>>>>>>>> 778065
>>>>>>>> NCAS/Centre for Environmental Data Archival
>>>>>>>> Email:alison.pamment at stfc.ac.uk <mailto:alison.pamment at stfc.ac.uk>
>>>>>>>> STFC Rutherford Appleton Laboratory
>>>>>>>> R25, 2.22
>>>>>>>> Harwell Oxford, Didcot, OX11 0QX, U.K.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>> From: CF-metadata<cf-metadata-bounces at cgd.ucar.edu>
>>>>>>>> <mailto:cf-metadata-bounces at cgd.ucar.edu>? On Behalf Of Alison
>>>>>>>> Pamment - UKRI STFC
>>>>>>>> Sent: 25 July 2018 13:12
>>>>>>>> To: Hamilton, Steve<sj.hamilton at fugro.com>
>>>>>>>> <mailto:sj.hamilton at fugro.com>;cf-metadata at cgd.ucar.edu
>>>>>>>> <mailto:cf-metadata at cgd.ucar.edu>
>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [CF-metadata] Platform Heave
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Dear Steve, Nan, et al,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Thank you for proposing new standard names for platform_heave
>>>>>>>> and improved definitions for existing names for platform pitch,
>>>>>>>> roll and yaw. Thank you also to all those who submitted
>>>>>>>> comments about these names.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Regarding Steve's proposals for new names, the discussion seems
>>>>>>>> to have reached consensus on the quantities themselves.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Until now, our usual explanatory sentence for 'platform' has
>>>>>>>> said 'Standard names for platform describe the motion and
>>>>>>>> orientation of the vehicle from which observations are made
>>>>>>>> e.g. aeroplane, ship or satellite.' Nan has suggested extending
>>>>>>>> the list of possible platforms, which seems fair enough, so we
>>>>>>>> would now have 'Standard names for platform describe the motion
>>>>>>>> and orientation of the vehicle from which observations are
>>>>>>>> made. Platforms include, but are not limited to, satellites,
>>>>>>>> aeroplanes, ships, instruments, and buoys.' I've added this
>>>>>>>> into the definitions of Steve's names, leading to:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> platform_heave (m)
>>>>>>>> 'Standard names for "platform" describe the motion and
>>>>>>>> orientation of the vehicle from which observations are made.
>>>>>>>> Platforms include, but are not limited to, satellites,
>>>>>>>> aeroplanes, ships, instruments, and buoys. "Heave" means the
>>>>>>>> vertical displacement of a platform (positive upwards) over a
>>>>>>>> measurement time interval.'
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> platform_heave_rate (m s-1)
>>>>>>>> 'Standard names for "platform" describe the motion and
>>>>>>>> orientation of the vehicle from which observations are made.
>>>>>>>> Platforms include, but are not limited to, satellites,
>>>>>>>> aeroplanes, ships, instruments, and buoys "Heave" means the
>>>>>>>> vertical displacement of a platform (positive upwards) over a
>>>>>>>> measurement time interval. "Heave rate" means the rate of
>>>>>>>> change of vertical displacement of the platform over a
>>>>>>>> measurement time interval.'
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> These two names are accepted for publication in the standard
>>>>>>>> name table and will be added in the next update, planned for
>>>>>>>> 6th August.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> We have six existing platform pitch, roll and yaw names:
>>>>>>>> platform_pitch_angle (degree)
>>>>>>>> platform_pitch_rate (degree s-1)
>>>>>>>> platform_roll_angle (degree)
>>>>>>>> platform_roll_rate (degree s-1)
>>>>>>>> platform_yaw_angle (degree)
>>>>>>>> platform_yaw_rate (degree s-1)
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Nan has suggested the following definitions, based
>>>>>>>> onhttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ship_motions
>>>>>>>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__en.wikipedia.org_wiki_Ship-5Fmotions&d=DwMDaQ&c=qKdtBuuu6dQK9MsRUVJ2DPXW6oayO8fu4TfEHS8sGNk&r=Vm7o2ZGxPkkqRuPs8nVMVQ&m=fsDk1eg5rM-so0h_XCTK_Pl1w5MGnQK88vuvHcbhUUI&s=gxXkUfvVSqtWNEzxwyAeuKgEMzADzXWv2OOZtOBRAao&e=>.
>>>>>>>> (A quick search of other online sources yields definitions
>>>>>>>> consistent with these).
>>>>>>>> Pitch
>>>>>>>> The up/down rotation of a platform about its transverse/Y axis.
>>>>>>>> The transverse/Y axis, lateral or pitch axis is an imaginary
>>>>>>>> line running horizontally across the platform and through its
>>>>>>>> center of gravity. A pitch? motion is an up-or-down movement of
>>>>>>>> the bow and stern of the platform.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Roll
>>>>>>>> The tilting rotation of a platform about its longitudinal/X
>>>>>>>> axis. The longitudinal/X axis, or roll axis, is an imaginary
>>>>>>>> line running horizontally through the length of the platform,
>>>>>>>> through its center of gravity, and parallel to the waterline. A
>>>>>>>> roll motion is a side-to-side or port-starboard tilting motion
>>>>>>>> of the superstructure around this axis.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Yaw
>>>>>>>> The turning rotation of a platform about its vertical/Z axis.
>>>>>>>> The vertical/Z axis, or yaw axis, is an imaginary line running
>>>>>>>> vertically through the platform and through its center of
>>>>>>>> gravity. A yaw motion is a side-to side movement of the bow and
>>>>>>>> stern of the ship.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> These are useful and concise definitions. I suggest that we
>>>>>>>> don't refer anywhere to 'ship', 'bow' or 'stern', since we want
>>>>>>>> the definitions to apply to all possible platforms. I'm
>>>>>>>> thinking also that 'port' and 'starboard' may apply to ships
>>>>>>>> and aeroplanes, but perhaps not to a satellite, so are probably
>>>>>>>> best avoided. Similarly, 'waterline' only applies to maritime
>>>>>>>> platforms. I suggest the following amendments to make the
>>>>>>>> definitions as generic as possible:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Pitch
>>>>>>>> "Pitch" means rotation of the platform in the vertical plane
>>>>>>>> about its transverse/Y axis. The transverse/Y axis, also known
>>>>>>>> as the "lateral axis" or "pitch axis", is an imaginary line
>>>>>>>> running horizontally across the platform and through its center
>>>>>>>> of gravity. In pitch motion, the leading edge of the platform
>>>>>>>> moves vertically upwards while the rear moves vertically
>>>>>>>> downwards, and vice versa.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Roll
>>>>>>>> "Roll" means rotation of the platform in the vertical plane
>>>>>>>> about its longitudinal/X axis. The longitudinal/X axis, also
>>>>>>>> known as the "roll axis", is an imaginary line running
>>>>>>>> horizontally through the length of the platform and through its
>>>>>>>> center of gravity. In roll motion, the platform tilts such that
>>>>>>>> one side moves vertically upwards while the other moves
>>>>>>>> vertically downwards, and vice versa.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Yaw
>>>>>>>> "Yaw" means rotation of the platform in the horizontal plane
>>>>>>>> about its vertical/Z axis. The vertical/Z axis, also known as
>>>>>>>> the "yaw axis", is an imaginary line running vertically through
>>>>>>>> the platform and through its center of gravity. In yaw motion,
>>>>>>>> the platform rotates clockwise or counter clockwise in the
>>>>>>>> horizontal, relative to its orientation, which has the standard
>>>>>>>> name platform_orientation.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Are these okay?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> For names such as platform_view_angle and platform_zenith_angle
>>>>>>>> we also describe how the angle itself is measured. We should do
>>>>>>>> the same for pitch, roll and yaw angles while we are in the
>>>>>>>> process of updating the definitions. I have come up with the
>>>>>>>> following:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Pitch angle
>>>>>>>> Platform pitch angle is the angle between the local horizontal
>>>>>>>> and the platform's longitudinal/X axis. Zero pitch angle means
>>>>>>>> the longitudinal axis is horizontal. The usual sign convention
>>>>>>>> is that pitch angle is measured positive when the front or
>>>>>>>> leading edge of the platform is elevated above the horizontal,
>>>>>>>> negative when it is below the horizontal.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Roll angle
>>>>>>>> Platform roll angle is the angle between the local horizontal
>>>>>>>> and the platform's lateral/Y axis. Zero roll angle means the
>>>>>>>> lateral axis is horizontal. The usual sign convention is that
>>>>>>>> roll angle is measured positive when the right hand edge of the
>>>>>>>> platform (when viewing towards the orientation direction or
>>>>>>>> "front" of the platform) is elevated above the horizontal,
>>>>>>>> negative when it is below the horizontal.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Yaw angle
>>>>>>>> Platform yaw angle is the angle between the platform's
>>>>>>>> longitudinal/X axis and the direction of travel. Zero yaw angle
>>>>>>>> means the longitudinal axis is aligned with the direction of
>>>>>>>> travel, or a reference direction if the platform is stationary.
>>>>>>>> The usual sign convention is that yaw angle is measured
>>>>>>>> positive when the front or leading edge of the platform is
>>>>>>>> rotated clockwise from its orientation (which has the standard
>>>>>>>> name platform_orientation).
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Just so we can see a couple of examples of pulling all this
>>>>>>>> together, I've written out the full revised definitions of
>>>>>>>> platform platform_pitch_angle and platform_pitch_rate below.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> platform_pitch_angle (degree)
>>>>>>>> 'Standard names for "platform" describe the motion and
>>>>>>>> orientation of the vehicle from which observations are made.
>>>>>>>> Platforms include, but are not limited to, satellites,
>>>>>>>> aeroplanes, ships, instruments and buoys. "Pitch" means
>>>>>>>> rotation of the platform in the vertical plane about its
>>>>>>>> transverse/Y axis. The transverse/Y axis, also known as the
>>>>>>>> "lateral axis" or "pitch axis", is an imaginary line running
>>>>>>>> horizontally across the platform and through its center of
>>>>>>>> gravity. In pitch motion, the leading edge of the platform
>>>>>>>> moves vertically upwards while the rear moves vertically
>>>>>>>> downwards, and vice versa. Platform pitch angle is the angle
>>>>>>>> between the local horizontal and the platform's longitudinal/X
>>>>>>>> axis. Zero pitch angle means the longitudinal axis is
>>>>>>>> horizontal. The usual sign convention is that pitch angle is
>>>>>>>> measured positive when the front or leading edge of the
>>>>>>>> platform is elevated above the horizontal, negative when it is
>>>>>>>> below the horizontal.'
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> platform_pitch_rate (degree s-1)
>>>>>>>> 'Standard names for "platform" describe the motion and
>>>>>>>> orientation of the vehicle from which observations are made.
>>>>>>>> Platforms include, but are not limited to, satellites,
>>>>>>>> aeroplanes, ships, instruments and buoys. "Pitch" means
>>>>>>>> rotation of the platform in the vertical plane about its
>>>>>>>> transverse/Y axis. The transverse/Y axis, also known as the
>>>>>>>> "lateral axis" or "pitch axis", is an imaginary line running
>>>>>>>> horizontally across the platform and through its center of
>>>>>>>> gravity. In pitch motion, the leading edge of the platform
>>>>>>>> moves vertically upwards while the rear moves vertically
>>>>>>>> downwards, and vice versa. The quantity with standard name
>>>>>>>> platform_pitch_rate is the change per unit time in the quantity
>>>>>>>> with standard name platform_pitch_angle.'
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The roll and yaw definitions would be constructed similarly.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The pitch/roll/yaw names are still under discussion. I'd
>>>>>>>> welcome further comments on these.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Best wishes,
>>>>>>>> Alison
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ------
>>>>>>>> Alison Pamment???????????????????????????????? Tel: +44 1235
>>>>>>>> 778065
>>>>>>>> NCAS/Centre for Environmental Data Archival
>>>>>>>> Email:alison.pamment at stfc.ac.uk <mailto:alison.pamment at stfc.ac.uk>
>>>>>>>> STFC Rutherford Appleton Laboratory
>>>>>>>> R25, 2.22
>>>>>>>> Harwell Oxford, Didcot, OX11 0QX, U.K.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>> From: CF-metadata<cf-metadata-bounces at cgd.ucar.edu>
>>>>>>>> <mailto:cf-metadata-bounces at cgd.ucar.edu>? On Behalf Of
>>>>>>>> Hamilton, Steve
>>>>>>>> Sent: 11 July 2018 10:52
>>>>>>>> To:cf-metadata at cgd.ucar.edu <mailto:cf-metadata at cgd.ucar.edu>
>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [CF-metadata] Platform Heave
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Hi Nan,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I agree expanding on the existing standard name descriptions
>>>>>>>> does make sense and standardising for _rate and _angle
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> What you suggest below seems acceptable
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Thanks
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Steve
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>> From: CF-metadata<cf-metadata-bounces at cgd.ucar.edu>
>>>>>>>> <mailto:cf-metadata-bounces at cgd.ucar.edu>? On Behalf Of Nan
>>>>>>>> Galbraith
>>>>>>>> Sent: 10 July 2018 17:39
>>>>>>>> To:cf-metadata at cgd.ucar.edu <mailto:cf-metadata at cgd.ucar.edu>
>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [CF-metadata] Platform Heave
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Hi Alison, Steve, and all -
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Since we have a little time to finalize this, could we also
>>>>>>>> consider updating the definitions of platform_pitch_angle,
>>>>>>>> platform_roll_angle and platform_yaw_angle?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Currently, these all say 'Standard names for platform describe
>>>>>>>> the motion and orientation of the vehicle from which
>>>>>>>> observations are made e.g. aeroplane, ship or satellite.'
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> John Helly pointed to the helpful Wikipedia page for ship
>>>>>>>> motion,https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ship_motions
>>>>>>>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__en.wikipedia.org_wiki_Ship-5Fmotions&d=DwMDaQ&c=qKdtBuuu6dQK9MsRUVJ2DPXW6oayO8fu4TfEHS8sGNk&r=Vm7o2ZGxPkkqRuPs8nVMVQ&m=fsDk1eg5rM-so0h_XCTK_Pl1w5MGnQK88vuvHcbhUUI&s=gxXkUfvVSqtWNEzxwyAeuKgEMzADzXWv2OOZtOBRAao&e=>.
>>>>>>>> The suggestions below are merged from different sections of
>>>>>>>> that page, and might be a little ... long, but I'd also like to
>>>>>>>> append something like 'Platforms include but are not limited to
>>>>>>>> satellites, aeroplanes, ships, instruments, and buoys.'
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Pitch
>>>>>>>> The up/down rotation of a platform about its transverse/Y axis.
>>>>>>>> The transverse/Y axis, lateral or pitch axis is an imaginary
>>>>>>>> line running horizontally across the platform and through its
>>>>>>>> center of gravity. A pitch? motion is an up-or-down movement of
>>>>>>>> the bow and stern of the platform.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Roll
>>>>>>>> The tilting rotation of a platform about its longitudinal/X
>>>>>>>> axis. The longitudinal/X axis, or roll axis, is an imaginary
>>>>>>>> line running horizontally through the length of the platform,
>>>>>>>> through its center of gravity, and parallel to the waterline. A
>>>>>>>> roll motion is a side-to-side or port-starboard tilting motion
>>>>>>>> of the superstructure around this axis.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Yaw
>>>>>>>> The turning rotation of a platform about its vertical/Z axis.
>>>>>>>> The vertical/Z axis, or yaw axis, is an imaginary line running
>>>>>>>> vertically through the platform and through its center of gravity.
>>>>>>>> A yaw motion is a side-to side movement of the bow and stern of
>>>>>>>> the ship.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> And we had something like this for heave:
>>>>>>>> platform_heave (m) = upwards vertical displacement
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I suppose these could also be applied to platform_*_rates.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Regards -
>>>>>>>> Nan
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On 7/4/18 4:47 AM, Alison Pamment - UKRI STFC wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Dear Steve,? > > Thank you for your message and apologies for not
>>>>>>>>> having processed
>>>>>>>> ? > your proposals as yet. I have been working on the CMIP
>>>>>>>> names, but > they are reaching a conclusion and I will shortly
>>>>>>>> be looking through > the many other proposals that have been
>>>>>>>> waiting for attention. > > A quick look through the discussion
>>>>>>>> of your names shows they are > pretty much agreed. You need
>>>>>>>> take no further action at this time - I > will check that the
>>>>>>>> names and definitions are clear and consistent > with existing
>>>>>>>> names and get back to you on the list with any final > comments
>>>>>>>> or questions. Version 56 of the standard name table will be >
>>>>>>>> published later today - I think we can probably finalise your
>>>>>>>> names > in time for version 57. > > Best wishes, Alison
>>>>>>>>> ________________________________
>>>>>>>>> From: Hamilton, Steve<sj.hamilton at fugro.com>
>>>>>>>>> <mailto:sj.hamilton at fugro.com>
>>>>>>>>> Sent: 03 July 2018 09:12
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Please can you advise if this standard name has now been
>>>>>>>>> accepted and
>>>>>>>>> when it will be included in the CF Standard Names
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> If there is something else to do please let me know
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Thanks
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Steve
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> ________________________________
>>>>>>>>> From: Jim Biard <jbiard at cicsnc.org
>>>>>>>>> <mailto:jbiard at cicsnc.org><mailto:jbiard at cicsnc.org>
>>>>>>>>> <mailto:jbiard at cicsnc.org>>
>>>>>>>>> Sent: 01 June 2018 22:56
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Nan,
>>>>>>>>> Thanks for pulling things back in. I very much like the idea
>>>>>>>>> of keeping technology or specific methods out of the
>>>>>>>>> definition if at all possible, so I like your proposal. I
>>>>>>>>> expect we should include platform in the definition, as well
>>>>>>>>> as an indication that this is dynamic (over time). How about
>>>>>>>>> these definitions?
>>>>>>>>> platform_heave (m) = upwards vertical displacement of a
>>>>>>>>> platform over
>>>>>>>>> a measurement time interval platform_heave_rate (m s-1) =
>>>>>>>>> upwards rate
>>>>>>>>> of change in vertical displacement of a platform over a
>>>>>>>>> measurement time interval They leave out some detail but
>>>>>>>>> capture the relative nature of the quantities.
>>>>>>>>> (In my mind, the primary detail being left out is the 'net zero'
>>>>>>>>> nature of the quantities, which gets back to defining the
>>>>>>>>> 'moving-mean' sea level reference point.) Grace and peace,
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Jim
>>>>>>>>> On 6/1/18 11:23 AM, Nan Galbraith wrote:
>>>>>>>>> Hi all -
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> The latest version is confusing to me. The term 'a platform
>>>>>>>>> that is
>>>>>>>>> nominally at rest' does not apply to many platforms for which
>>>>>>>>> heave is
>>>>>>>>> calculated; the original version of that, 'a moving object
>>>>>>>>> above the
>>>>>>>>> vertical level of that object when stationary' was maybe a
>>>>>>>>> little more clear... if also a little wordy.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> And, the term? 'vertical displacement determined by integrating
>>>>>>>>> vertical accelerations' may also not apply - I've been looking
>>>>>>>>> at the
>>>>>>>>> different ways heave is calculated, and there are a few:
>>>>>>>>> 'Heave can be
>>>>>>>>> computed from GPS RTK height measurements and from vertical
>>>>>>>>> accelerations measured by linear accelerometers'
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Why? not keep it simple: platform_heave (m) = upwards vertical
>>>>>>>>> displacement?? Do we need to be more specific than that?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Thanks - Nan
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> From: Lowry, Roy K.
>>>>>>>>> Sent: 30 May 2018 21:37
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> An afterthought. Heave is conventionally positive upwards so
>>>>>>>>> to make this clear I would add the word 'upwards' thus:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> platform_heave (m) = upwards vertical displacement determined
>>>>>>>>> by integrating vertical accelerations of a platform that is
>>>>>>>>> nominally at rest.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> platform_heave_rate (m s-1) = upwards vertical velocity
>>>>>>>>> determined by integrating vertical accelerations of a platform
>>>>>>>>> that is nominally at rest.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Cheers. Roy.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> From: Lowry, Roy K. <rkl at bodc.ac.uk
>>>>>>>>> <mailto:rkl at bodc.ac.uk><mailto:rkl at bodc.ac.uk>
>>>>>>>>> <mailto:rkl at bodc.ac.uk>
>>>>>>>>> Sent: 30 May 2018 21:02
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Thanks Jim,
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> That work for me.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Cheers, Roy.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> From: Jim Biard<jbiard at cicsnc.org> <mailto:jbiard at cicsnc.org>
>>>>>>>>> Sent: 30 May 2018 18:39
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Roy,
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> So, heave is integrated vertical acceleration? How about
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> platform_heave (m) = vertical displacement determined by
>>>>>>>>> integrating vertical accelerations of a platform that is
>>>>>>>>> nominally at rest.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> platform_heave_rate (m s-1) = vertical velocity determined by
>>>>>>>>> integrating vertical accelerations of a platform that is
>>>>>>>>> nominally at rest.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Jim
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On 5/27/18 5:38 AM, Lowry, Roy K. wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> ????? Hi Jim,
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> ????? Does
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> ?????????? "Heave" is a term used to describe the vertical
>>>>>>>>> displacement
>>>>>>>>> ????????? of a moving object above the vertical level of that
>>>>>>>>> object
>>>>>>>>> ????????? when stationary.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> ????? help by getting rid of the semantically-loaded word
>>>>>>>>> 'height'?
>>>>>>>>> ????? If not, what would?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> ????? I think the confusion is because you are thinking of
>>>>>>>>> heave in
>>>>>>>>> ????? terms of position within a reference frame. To think of
>>>>>>>>> it as the
>>>>>>>>> ????? vertical displacement between a real platform and a
>>>>>>>>> massless
>>>>>>>>> ????? platform is misleading- such considerations are part of the
>>>>>>>>> ????? derivation of wave height from high frequency heave
>>>>>>>>> measurements,
>>>>>>>>> ????? which isn't relevant to a discussion of the raw
>>>>>>>>> measurement. It's
>>>>>>>>> ????? also worth bearing in mind that whilst the debate has
>>>>>>>>> focused on
>>>>>>>>> ????? platforms floating on the sea surface, the concept of
>>>>>>>>> heave could
>>>>>>>>> ????? in theory be applied to objects in the atmosphere.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> ????? In practice, heave is measured by accelerometers that
>>>>>>>>> are usually
>>>>>>>>> ????? combined with tilt sensors that give pitch, roll and
>>>>>>>>> yaw. Hence,
>>>>>>>>> ????? it is totally decoupled from any reference outside the
>>>>>>>>> platform.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> ????? To answer your last muse, to get heave from a high
>>>>>>>>> frequency
>>>>>>>>> ????? height relative to datum time series the method would
>>>>>>>>> need to
>>>>>>>>> ????? determine the height of the object when 'stationary'. In
>>>>>>>>> the case
>>>>>>>>> ????? of objects on the sea, 'stationary' is considered to be
>>>>>>>>> a flat
>>>>>>>>> ????? calm sea (i.e. no waves), which can be approximated by
>>>>>>>>> averaging
>>>>>>>>> ????? the raw time series. So, heave could be approximated by
>>>>>>>>> ????? differencing the raw and averaged data. However, I can't
>>>>>>>>> think why
>>>>>>>>> ????? anybody would want to do that.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> ????? Cheers, Roy.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> ????? From:Jim Biard<jbiard at cicsnc.org>
>>>>>>>>> <mailto:jbiard at cicsnc.org><mailto:jbiard at cicsnc.org>
>>>>>>>>> <mailto:jbiard at cicsnc.org>
>>>>>>>>> ????? Sent: 26 May 2018 23:18
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> ????? My biggest concern is that the standard name definition
>>>>>>>>> makes it
>>>>>>>>> ????? clear in some fashion or other that this is a measure of
>>>>>>>>> ????? deviations from some lower frequency (or low-pass filtered)
>>>>>>>>> ????? measure of vertical position. (As are sway and surge in
>>>>>>>>> relation
>>>>>>>>> ????? to their corresponding horizontal coordinates.) As was
>>>>>>>>> pointed
>>>>>>>>> ????? out, heave is used in certain communities, so it's
>>>>>>>>> reasonable to
>>>>>>>>> ????? provide a standard name, but it seems rather imprecise
>>>>>>>>> as it has
>>>>>>>>> ????? been described so far.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> ????? If I have understood the explanations correctly, a time
>>>>>>>>> series of
>>>>>>>>> ????? platform height relative to a fixed datum that has
>>>>>>>>> sufficient
>>>>>>>>> ????? precision and frequency would fully represent the heave
>>>>>>>>> along with
>>>>>>>>> ????? the more slowly varying effects of tide, waves, etc. So
>>>>>>>>> is heave,
>>>>>>>>> ????? as usually used, the first-order instantaneous
>>>>>>>>> difference between
>>>>>>>>> ????? the height of an actual platform and the height of a
>>>>>>>>> massless
>>>>>>>>> ????? ideal platform that would maintain a fixed offset
>>>>>>>>> relative to the
>>>>>>>>> ????? sea surface? And, just out of curiosity, how would a
>>>>>>>>> time series
>>>>>>>>> ????? of instantaneous measures of height relative to a fixed
>>>>>>>>> datum be
>>>>>>>>> ????? separated in practice into heave and "non-heave" height?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> ????? Getting back on track, it seems to me that the
>>>>>>>>> definition ought to
>>>>>>>>> ????? somehow assist the reader in understanding how heave
>>>>>>>>> relates to
>>>>>>>>> ????? other measures of height.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> ????? On Sat, May 26, 2018 at 3:11 AM, Lowry, Roy K. wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> ????????? Dear Jim and John,
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> ????????? Heave is indeed a height relative to a datum, that
>>>>>>>>> datum being
>>>>>>>>> ????????? the calm sea surface, which is a local short
>>>>>>>>> interval mean sea
>>>>>>>>> ????????? level that isn't linked into any global reference
>>>>>>>>> system.
>>>>>>>>> ????????? Indeed the 'datum' moves relative to the rest of the
>>>>>>>>> world -
>>>>>>>>> ????????? but not the platform - as tide rises and falls so
>>>>>>>>> many would
>>>>>>>>> ????????? prefer to call it an 'instrument zero' rather than a
>>>>>>>>> 'datum'.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> ????????? Heave is therefore a very different measurement to
>>>>>>>>> any sea
>>>>>>>>> ????????? level parameter and is the raw measurement recorded
>>>>>>>>> at high
>>>>>>>>> ????????? (Hz to kHz) frequency as a time series by floating wave
>>>>>>>>> ????????? instruments such as waveriders and shipborne wave
>>>>>>>>> recorders.
>>>>>>>>> ????????? It therefore cannot be sensibly described by the
>>>>>>>>> same or
>>>>>>>>> ????????? similar Standard Name as a measurement of height
>>>>>>>>> above a
>>>>>>>>> ????????? globally referenced datum like long-term mean sea
>>>>>>>>> level or
>>>>>>>>> ????????? geoid. Whilst the Standard Name could be
>>>>>>>>> ????????? 'platform_height_above_calm_sea_surface' or
>>>>>>>>> 'platform_height_above_stationary_position' I would argue that
>>>>>>>>> ????????? 'heave' is a term from the same domain vocabulary as
>>>>>>>>> 'pitch',
>>>>>>>>> ????????? 'roll' and 'yaw' and therefore should be used.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> ????????? John is right to point out that the heave
>>>>>>>>> measurement is
>>>>>>>>> ????????? affected by the nature of the platform with a
>>>>>>>>> 250,000 tonne
>>>>>>>>> ????????? supertanker moving up and down much less than a
>>>>>>>>> rowing boat in
>>>>>>>>> ????????? a given wave climate, especially a wind sea. That
>>>>>>>>> was what was
>>>>>>>>> ????????? behind the SBWR corrections based on platform
>>>>>>>>> dimensions set
>>>>>>>>> ????????? up by Laurie Draper and Tom Tucker back in the 1980s.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> ????????? Cheers, Roy.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> ????????? From: John Helly<hellyj at ucsd.edu>
>>>>>>>>> <mailto:hellyj at ucsd.edu>
>>>>>>>>> ????????? Sent: 26 May 2018 04:48
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> ????????? Can't let go of this yet.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> ????????? If you think about the inverse problem of deriving
>>>>>>>>> the sea
>>>>>>>>> ????????? surface elevation from the heave you would have to
>>>>>>>>> account for
>>>>>>>>> ????????? the latency of ship motion relative to the
>>>>>>>>> sea-surface. A
>>>>>>>>> ????????? wave passing under a ship induces motions that are not
>>>>>>>>> ????????? instantaneous either in attack or decay.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> ????????? J.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> ????????? On 5/25/18 20:42, John Helly wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> ????????????? I believe it's a synonym within the oceanographic
>>>>>>>>> ????????????? community for the vertical motion of an
>>>>>>>>> ocean-going platform.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ship_motions
>>>>>>>>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__en.wikipedia.org_wiki_Ship-5Fmotions&d=DwMDaQ&c=qKdtBuuu6dQK9MsRUVJ2DPXW6oayO8fu4TfEHS8sGNk&r=Vm7o2ZGxPkkqRuPs8nVMVQ&m=fsDk1eg5rM-so0h_XCTK_Pl1w5MGnQK88vuvHcbhUUI&s=gxXkUfvVSqtWNEzxwyAeuKgEMzADzXWv2OOZtOBRAao&e=>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> ????????????? Ship motions - Wikipedia
>>>>>>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ship_motions>
>>>>>>>>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__en.wikipedia.org_wiki_Ship-5Fmotions&d=DwMDaQ&c=qKdtBuuu6dQK9MsRUVJ2DPXW6oayO8fu4TfEHS8sGNk&r=Vm7o2ZGxPkkqRuPs8nVMVQ&m=fsDk1eg5rM-so0h_XCTK_Pl1w5MGnQK88vuvHcbhUUI&s=gxXkUfvVSqtWNEzxwyAeuKgEMzADzXWv2OOZtOBRAao&e=><https://en.wikipedia.org/
>>>>>>>>> wiki/Ship_motions>
>>>>>>>>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__en.wikipedia.org_wiki_Ship-5Fmotions&d=DwMDaQ&c=qKdtBuuu6dQK9MsRUVJ2DPXW6oayO8fu4TfEHS8sGNk&r=Vm7o2ZGxPkkqRuPs8nVMVQ&m=fsDk1eg5rM-so0h_XCTK_Pl1w5MGnQK88vuvHcbhUUI&s=gxXkUfvVSqtWNEzxwyAeuKgEMzADzXWv2OOZtOBRAao&e=>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> ????????????? en.wikipedia.org
>>>>>>>>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__en.wikipedia.org_&d=DwMFaQ&c=qKdtBuuu6dQK9MsRUVJ2DPXW6oayO8fu4TfEHS8sGNk&r=Vm7o2ZGxPkkqRuPs8nVMVQ&m=J2x5E3dUpn954rPN8-v-TFQOZiyobvfd2MaoRgJ8_Zg&s=vxsAvAgVXgUOS72MntIS3EeYgiYMynA6M4SbIbilSDk&e=>
>>>>>>>>> <http://en.wikipedia.org>
>>>>>>>>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__en.wikipedia.org&d=DwMDaQ&c=qKdtBuuu6dQK9MsRUVJ2DPXW6oayO8fu4TfEHS8sGNk&r=Vm7o2ZGxPkkqRuPs8nVMVQ&m=fsDk1eg5rM-so0h_XCTK_Pl1w5MGnQK88vuvHcbhUUI&s=tpfIR7_HY7_jSNmPjinu0I6CgCY2PCb65KOJTYnwrFg&e=><http://en.wikipedia.org>
>>>>>>>>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__en.wikipedia.org&d=DwMDaQ&c=qKdtBuuu6dQK9MsRUVJ2DPXW6oayO8fu4TfEHS8sGNk&r=Vm7o2ZGxPkkqRuPs8nVMVQ&m=fsDk1eg5rM-so0h_XCTK_Pl1w5MGnQK88vuvHcbhUUI&s=tpfIR7_HY7_jSNmPjinu0I6CgCY2PCb65KOJTYnwrFg&e=>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> ????????????? Ship motions are defined by the six degrees of
>>>>>>>>> freedom
>>>>>>>>> ????????????? that a ship, boat or any other craft can
>>>>>>>>> experience.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> ????????????? Could just be jargon but it strike me as more
>>>>>>>>> complex:
>>>>>>>>> ????????????? nonetheless a vertical position relative to a
>>>>>>>>> datum, but
>>>>>>>>> ????????????? the buoyancy, stability and momentum of the
>>>>>>>>> platform are
>>>>>>>>> ????????????? implied as part of the dynamics.? It seems that
>>>>>>>>> the datum
>>>>>>>>> ????????????? is not a geophysical one alone but confounded
>>>>>>>>> with the
>>>>>>>>> ????????????? 'normal' waterline for a platform so it may be
>>>>>>>>> relative to
>>>>>>>>> ????????????? the water level in which the platform is
>>>>>>>>> embedded. That's
>>>>>>>>> ????????????? a tough one. Two different platforms on the same
>>>>>>>>> sea
>>>>>>>>> ????????????? surface would have different 'heave', for example.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> ????????????? J.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> ????????????? On 5/25/18 19:54, Jim Biard wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????? Hi.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????? I get and endorse the need for pitch, roll,
>>>>>>>>> and yaw,
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????? but I remain perplexed about heave. How is a
>>>>>>>>> time
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????? series of 'heave' different from a time
>>>>>>>>> series of
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????? height relative to some vertical datum? I've
>>>>>>>>> yet to
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????? see a proposed definition that convinces me
>>>>>>>>> that this
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????? is a uniquely different quantity.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????? Grace and peace,
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????? Jim
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????? On Fri, May 25, 2018 at 7:28 AM, Lowry, Roy K.
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????? <rkl at bodc.ac.uk
>>>>>>>>> <mailto:rkl at bodc.ac.uk><mailto:rkl at bodc.ac.uk>
>>>>>>>>> <mailto:rkl at bodc.ac.uk>? wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? Dear All,
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? I agree with Nan that definitions of
>>>>>>>>> pitch roll
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? and yaw would improve the existing
>>>>>>>>> Standard Name
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? definitions. I also agree with using the
>>>>>>>>> existing
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? orientation Standard Names for ADCPs and
>>>>>>>>> that the
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? 'platform' definition wording could make
>>>>>>>>> this
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? clearer. However, such an enhancements
>>>>>>>>> should be
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? submitted as a separate proposal and not be
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? considered as part of Steve's proposal.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? Cheers, Roy.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? From:? Nan
>>>>>>>>> Galbraith<ngalbraith at whoi.edu> <mailto:ngalbraith at whoi.edu>
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? Sent: 25 May 2018 14:46
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? I'd really like to see pitch, roll and
>>>>>>>>> yaw defined
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? in the CF standard name table; currently
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? the definitions only say 'Standard names
>>>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? platform describe the motion and
>>>>>>>>> orientation
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? of the vehicle from which observations
>>>>>>>>> are made
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? e.g. aeroplane, ship or satellite.'
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? Also, not to get too far into the weeds,
>>>>>>>>> but many
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? of the platform terms are important
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? for instruments like ADCPs, so I'd just
>>>>>>>>> like to
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? confirm that these definitions - and
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? the names themselves - can be used to
>>>>>>>>> describe
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? instruments, not just vehicles
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? 'e.g. aeroplane, ship or satellite'. We
>>>>>>>>> already
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? use pitch roll and yaw for these
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? instruments on surface moorings, and I
>>>>>>>>> hope (and
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? assume) this is legal.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? Thanks - Nan Galbraith
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? On 5/25/18 8:53 AM, Lowry, Roy K. wrote:
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? >
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? >
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? > Dear Steve,
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? >
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? >
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? > One of the reasons I was interested in
>>>>>>>>> your
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? definitions was your
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? > perspective on the datum (i.e. zero
>>>>>>>>> value) for
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? heave. The datum
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? > 'mean_sea_level' is well used in CF,
>>>>>>>>> but with
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? the definition 'time
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? > mean of sea surface elevation at a given
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? location over an arbitrary
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? > period sufficient to eliminate the tidal
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? signals.' This is obviously
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? > not appropriate for platform heave
>>>>>>>>> which doesn't
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? take any account of
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? > the state of the tide and so I would
>>>>>>>>> exclude
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? 'mean_sea_level' from the
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? > Standard Name.
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? >
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? >
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? > I think my preference would be to keep
>>>>>>>>> the term
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? 'heave' as we already
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? > have 'pitch', 'yaw' and 'roll', giving:
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? >
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? >
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? > platform_heave (m)
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? >
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? >
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? > Standard names for platform describe
>>>>>>>>> the motion
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? and orientation of the
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? > vehicle from which observations are
>>>>>>>>> made e.g.
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? aeroplane, ship or
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? > satellite. "Heave" is a term used to
>>>>>>>>> describe
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? the vertical
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? > displacement of the platform above its
>>>>>>>>> position
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? when not moving.
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? >
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? >
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? > tendency_of_platform_heave (m s-1)
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? >
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? >
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? > Standard names for platform describe
>>>>>>>>> the motion
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? and orientation of the
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? > vehicle from which observations are
>>>>>>>>> made e.g.
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? aeroplane, ship or
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? > satellite. "Tendency_of_X" means
>>>>>>>>> derivative of X
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? with respect to time.
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? > "Heave" is a term used to describe the
>>>>>>>>> vertical
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? displacement of the
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? > platform above its position when not
>>>>>>>>> moving.
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? >
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? >
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? > What do you think?
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? >
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? >
>>>>>>>>> ????????????????????? > Cheers, Roy.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>> *******************************************************
>>>>>>>> * Nan Galbraith??????? Information Systems Specialist *
>>>>>>>> * Upper Ocean Processes Group??????????? Mail Stop 29 *
>>>>>>>> * Woods Hole Oceanographic Institution??????????????? *
>>>>>>>> * Woods Hole, MA 02543???????????????? (508) 289-2444 *
>>>>>>>> *******************************************************
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>> CF-metadata mailing list
>>>>>>>> CF-metadata at cgd.ucar.edu <mailto:CF-metadata at cgd.ucar.edu>
>>>>>>>> http://mailman.cgd.ucar.edu/mailman/listinfo/cf-metadata
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>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>> CF-metadata mailing list
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>>>>>>>> http://mailman.cgd.ucar.edu/mailman/listinfo/cf-metadata
>>>>>>>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__mailman.cgd.ucar.edu_mailman_listinfo_cf-2Dmetadata&d=DwMDaQ&c=qKdtBuuu6dQK9MsRUVJ2DPXW6oayO8fu4TfEHS8sGNk&r=Vm7o2ZGxPkkqRuPs8nVMVQ&m=fsDk1eg5rM-so0h_XCTK_Pl1w5MGnQK88vuvHcbhUUI&s=CiiBFNLLM7XQeXxCJzRPmC0xdxNR8BhH_tI-syw7_5k&e=>
>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>> CF-metadata mailing list
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>>>>>>>> http://mailman.cgd.ucar.edu/mailman/listinfo/cf-metadata
>>>>>>>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__mailman.cgd.ucar.edu_mailman_listinfo_cf-2Dmetadata&d=DwMDaQ&c=qKdtBuuu6dQK9MsRUVJ2DPXW6oayO8fu4TfEHS8sGNk&r=Vm7o2ZGxPkkqRuPs8nVMVQ&m=fsDk1eg5rM-so0h_XCTK_Pl1w5MGnQK88vuvHcbhUUI&s=CiiBFNLLM7XQeXxCJzRPmC0xdxNR8BhH_tI-syw7_5k&e=>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> CICS-NC
>>>>>>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.cicsnc.org_&d=DwMDaQ&c=qKdtBuuu6dQK9MsRUVJ2DPXW6oayO8fu4TfEHS8sGNk&r=Vm7o2ZGxPkkqRuPs8nVMVQ&m=fsDk1eg5rM-so0h_XCTK_Pl1w5MGnQK88vuvHcbhUUI&s=8lHJz6dH2XHkNWXpzlPzw9Vx2dTDwQ5Ow4uXUIZBPZU&e=>Visit
>>>>>>> us on
>>>>>>> Facebook
>>>>>>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.facebook.com_cicsnc&d=DwMDaQ&c=qKdtBuuu6dQK9MsRUVJ2DPXW6oayO8fu4TfEHS8sGNk&r=Vm7o2ZGxPkkqRuPs8nVMVQ&m=fsDk1eg5rM-so0h_XCTK_Pl1w5MGnQK88vuvHcbhUUI&s=oNLIHSVmCaO1TkAm6PFzxmtZ9Wz1oyQ9pzpsG7e3obE&e=>
>>>>>>> ????*Jim Biard*
>>>>>>> *Research Scholar*
>>>>>>> Cooperative Institute for Climate and Satellites
>>>>>>> NC<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__cicsnc.org_&d=DwMDaQ&c=qKdtBuuu6dQK9MsRUVJ2DPXW6oayO8fu4TfEHS8sGNk&r=Vm7o2ZGxPkkqRuPs8nVMVQ&m=fsDk1eg5rM-so0h_XCTK_Pl1w5MGnQK88vuvHcbhUUI&s=J44MNoS3a3tRZadexG7eUT9VHnim-C1Q38Gg053klgA&e=>
>>>>>>> North Carolina State
>>>>>>> University<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__ncsu.edu_&d=DwMDaQ&c=qKdtBuuu6dQK9MsRUVJ2DPXW6oayO8fu4TfEHS8sGNk&r=Vm7o2ZGxPkkqRuPs8nVMVQ&m=fsDk1eg5rM-so0h_XCTK_Pl1w5MGnQK88vuvHcbhUUI&s=VFiaA8MAm8rNiE-oSavyuVxEWBUhGmkoZLFec_ZFYlo&e=>
>>>>>>> NOAA National Centers for Environmental
>>>>>>> Information<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__ncdc.noaa.gov_&d=DwMDaQ&c=qKdtBuuu6dQK9MsRUVJ2DPXW6oayO8fu4TfEHS8sGNk&r=Vm7o2ZGxPkkqRuPs8nVMVQ&m=fsDk1eg5rM-so0h_XCTK_Pl1w5MGnQK88vuvHcbhUUI&s=F-xQ7THSSP276ClTb8arUk9hFLSJ8wJhSEKZwbfQNVM&e=>
>>>>>>> /formerly NOAA?s National Climatic Data Center/
>>>>>>> 151 Patton Ave, Asheville, NC 28801
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>>>>>>> o: +1 828 271 4900
>>>>>>>
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>>>>>>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__twitter.com_NOAANCEIocngeo&d=DwMDaQ&c=qKdtBuuu6dQK9MsRUVJ2DPXW6oayO8fu4TfEHS8sGNk&r=Vm7o2ZGxPkkqRuPs8nVMVQ&m=fsDk1eg5rM-so0h_XCTK_Pl1w5MGnQK88vuvHcbhUUI&s=GcsHw9fQDVUMabWDrGLrdXOZLmCJ5UWXcapPHOUcwdE&e=>./
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>> CF-metadata mailing list
>>>>>>> CF-metadata at cgd.ucar.edu <mailto:CF-metadata at cgd.ucar.edu>
>>>>>>> http://mailman.cgd.ucar.edu/mailman/listinfo/cf-metadata
>>>>>>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__mailman.cgd.ucar.edu_mailman_listinfo_cf-2Dmetadata&d=DwMFaQ&c=qKdtBuuu6dQK9MsRUVJ2DPXW6oayO8fu4TfEHS8sGNk&r=Vm7o2ZGxPkkqRuPs8nVMVQ&m=J2x5E3dUpn954rPN8-v-TFQOZiyobvfd2MaoRgJ8_Zg&s=7WZod_Yl4Ny2ikX4Vb__7Og8ciU0cQVZe4z5EPcKMe0&e=>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> Kenneth E. Kehoe
>>>>>> ?? Research Associate - University of Oklahoma
>>>>>> ?? Cooperative Institute for Mesoscale Meteorological Studies
>>>>>> ?? ARM Climate Research Facility - Data Quality Office
>>>>>> ?? e-mail:kkehoe at ou.edu <mailto:kkehoe at ou.edu>? | Office:
>>>>>> 303-497-4754 | Cell: 405-826-0299
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Kenneth E. Kehoe
>>
>
--
CICS-NC <http://www.cicsnc.org/> Visit us on
Facebook <http://www.facebook.com/cicsnc> *Jim Biard*
*Research Scholar*
Cooperative Institute for Climate and Satellites NC <http://cicsnc.org/>
North Carolina State University <http://ncsu.edu/>
NOAA National Centers for Environmental Information <http://ncdc.noaa.gov/>
/formerly NOAA?s National Climatic Data Center/
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